Author Topic: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?  (Read 550306 times)

Offline Noldi400

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #345 on: January 29, 2013, 01:26:13 AM »
Gene Kranz said in his book that NASA fully expected to lose one or two astronauts during Mercury. Gemini had at least two life-threatening emergencies I can think of right now (Gemini 8 spinning out of control and Gene Cernan's self-described "EVA from hell" on Gemini 9). But NASA was not willing to risk lives for Apollo? Explain please.

And why did three astronauts die during a test of the Command Module? If it wasn't really going to the Moon, why did they have to test it?
And Cernan again, on Apollo 10 when the LM ascent stage computers sent them into a tumbling cartwheel less than 10 miles off the surface and came (according to Cernan) within two seconds of crashing.

Performed flawlessly every time, indeed. The only reason the missions appeared to go flawlessly was month and years of hard work by all concerned.
"The sane understand that human beings are incapable of sustaining conspiracies on a grand scale, because some of our most defining qualities as a species are... a tendency to panic, and an inability to keep our mouths shut." - Dean Koontz

Offline alexsanchez

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #346 on: January 29, 2013, 01:29:02 AM »
Maybe we really went to the moon.

That's certainly how all the available evidence is interpreted unanimously by the appropriately educated and experienced people.
If I have any other questions I know where to come.

Offline raven

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #347 on: January 29, 2013, 01:34:05 AM »
If I have any other questions I know where to come.
I have a question for you. Actually, I have several, but this one is forefront. Why the sudden change?

Offline Zakalwe

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #348 on: January 29, 2013, 01:43:47 AM »
The issue of moon rocks is purely a matter for debate. 

Of course you can. But you'd have no evidence (not one shred) to support your argument.

The rest of this outlandish post has been thoroughly debunked, so I'll not repeat others, bar a couple of points:

1) You have provided no evidence of American sample returns,
2) You have provided no evidence that you have nay geological qualifications or experience (remember hoaxie, just because you say that something could have happened, doesn't mean that it did. Especially if there's not a jot of evidence to support your belief)
3) A test LM hanging from a helium balloon? Awww come on! What sort of engineering have you been involved in? Baby buggy engineering????
4) Still no offer to complete on your bet. I told you that I'm prepared to put money on the line. Whats up hoaxie...not able to put up the evidence??
5) Now that you've admitted that Jack White was talking through his ass, you are yet to say at what point the evidence becomes believable. Or put it another way- whats your next bit to be debunked. So far you've had your daft LM cant take off without a theodolite debunked. now you've had White's images debunked. Whats next?

I await your response with bated breath.....
"The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.' " - Isaac Asimov

Offline Peter B

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #349 on: January 29, 2013, 01:46:01 AM »
...We got nothing out of going to the moon except national prestige, and political and military advantage, and supposedly a bunch of moon rocks.
What's with the supposedly?

Did NASA acquire genuine Moon rocks or not? If not, in the light of what we've explained about them, please explain what they are.

What are your objections to the reality of the Apollo rocks?
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Offline ka9q

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #350 on: January 29, 2013, 01:46:07 AM »
You only get a couple photons back from a laser burst according to UCSD.
This is a good example of the worthlessness of uninformed incredulity.That's right, you only get a couple of photons. But they're enough.

Yes, even when the laser is off the moon sends many photons toward the earth. But not all photons are the same, and that's the crucial difference. For the telescope to count a particular photon it must first pass this gauntlet:

1. The telescope sees only photons from a tiny part of the lunar surface centered on the reflector in use. All other lunar photons don't even make it through the telescope.

2. The detector only sees photons with the wavelength of the laser. Reflected sunlight is spread over many wavelengths, so most are filtered and ignored.

3. Most important of all, the ranging system already knows the approximate distance to the moon so it only responds to photons arriving within literally nanoseconds of the expected time.

These criteria are so selective that when you apply them to the huge numbers of reflected solar photons, essentially none make it through. And that's what makes it possible to detect those few laser photons that do make it back to the telescope.

The Mythbusters episode, if you watched it, showed a scatter plot of received photons vs time at the Apache Point site. When the laser was off or not pointed at a reflector, you only saw a few points scattered randomly over the graph. When a return was acquired, a very obvious black bar of dots formed right across the middle. There is simply no way around it: the system works, and only because of the artificial reflectors placed there by Apollo and Luna.


Offline Noldi400

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #351 on: January 29, 2013, 01:50:23 AM »
Ya gotta give him points for technique on the flounce, though.

 ::)If not for sincerity...
"The sane understand that human beings are incapable of sustaining conspiracies on a grand scale, because some of our most defining qualities as a species are... a tendency to panic, and an inability to keep our mouths shut." - Dean Koontz

Offline Zakalwe

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #352 on: January 29, 2013, 01:52:43 AM »
My spidey senses are picking up a stealth flounce.....


"The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.' " - Isaac Asimov

Offline alexsanchez

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #353 on: January 29, 2013, 01:56:22 AM »
If I have any other questions I know where to come.
I have a question for you. Actually, I have several, but this one is forefront. Why the sudden change?
While I still maintain it was possible to fake, there's adequate argument to maintain that it wasn't.  There's still a few things I want to check out though.

Offline raven

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #354 on: January 29, 2013, 01:58:21 AM »
Another fun fact.
SMART-1 did some  remote spectrography work when it was orbiting the moon, using known results from Luna sample return and Apollo sites to help calibrate the instrument, both Luna and Apollo which you claimed were faked somehow and/or used lunar meteorites. These results make that rather impossible as there is no way the results could agree, either with each other or the SMART-1 results. In case the big ESA logo didn't give it away, SMART-1 was a European Space Agency probe, affiliated with neither the United States or Russia.

Offline Zakalwe

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #355 on: January 29, 2013, 02:03:19 AM »
Performed flawlessly every time, indeed. The only reason the missions appeared to go flawlessly was month and years of hard work by all concerned.


Indeed. Tom Kelly's book is a great read on just how many issues they experienced. Welds cracking, leaking pipework, windows shattering are just a couple that spring to mind.

What about Apollo 5? Software errors meant the LM didn't perform as expected (a suspected fuel leak meant that the tanks weren't pressurised at the right time, which "tripped" the computer up).
What about Apollo 11? The famous 1202 alarms?

Just about every mission had issues or failures in the system that could have lead to an abort (not all down to the LM). Rigorous testing and good contingency planning meant that the missions could proceed despite these errors.
"The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.' " - Isaac Asimov

Offline Zakalwe

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #356 on: January 29, 2013, 02:07:20 AM »
While I still maintain it was possible to fake, there's adequate argument to maintain that it wasn't.  There's still a few things I want to check out though.

Your adherence to that is noted. However it was not possible to fake it. Not to anywhere near the level of detail that the historical record clearly shows.

Stick around and check them out here. We might all learn something. Though my gut feeling is that you won't. You'll stealth flounce and continue to peddle your hoaxie claims under another name somewhere else.

It's also a shame that you have deprived a charity of some cash as well....

"The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.' " - Isaac Asimov

Offline Abaddon

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #357 on: January 29, 2013, 02:08:15 AM »
If I have any other questions I know where to come.
I have a question for you. Actually, I have several, but this one is forefront. Why the sudden change?
While I still maintain it was possible to fake, there's adequate argument to maintain that it wasn't.  There's still a few things I want to check out though.
You are going to attempt a fringe reset, right?

Offline Glom

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #358 on: January 29, 2013, 02:59:39 AM »
So wait, 2001 is both so well done is shows how you can fake a real moonlanding and already deliberately done poorly.

That's not the most ridiculous thing a conspiracy theorist has said.

Offline Zakalwe

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Re: why was the usa the only one to go to the moon?
« Reply #359 on: January 29, 2013, 03:09:21 AM »
So wait, 2001 is both so well done is shows how you can fake a real moonlanding and already deliberately done poorly.

That's not the most ridiculous thing a conspiracy theorist has said.


"The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.' " - Isaac Asimov