Author Topic: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?  (Read 863933 times)

Offline Andromeda

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1185 on: January 27, 2013, 05:33:28 PM »
And I'm a guy who was kicked off one conspiracy forum for being too liberal and proposing the ISS was real!!!

Such a claim is easy to check... I can see you stormed off in a huff (multiple times) after being caught in a lie and dishing out abuse.

Isn't it funny how you and Heiwa both posted on the same thread over there?  ::)  Watching you two argue was amusing.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2013, 05:45:58 PM by Andromeda »
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Offline frenat

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1186 on: January 27, 2013, 05:42:09 PM »
Someone calling themselves 'Heiwa' has just joined the board. If it's him, perhaps he's come here to discuss his views.

I noted some visitors to my popular web site from Apollohoaxforum so I decided to join. My name is actually Anders Björkman but on Internet forums I am Heiwa. My company is Heiwa Co. A am evidently an engineer and work scientifically using first principles all the time. I am not in conspiracy theories. I just report my observations and calculations and results. If you do not like them, tell me what is wrong with them.

Do not worry. The MONEY is there for anyone, incl. NASA, JPL, SPACEX, ESA, to show that human moon travel is possible, à la Apollo 11 1969. Just copy paste the Apollo 11 NASA data and demonstrate that it really works and the money is yours. IMHO it was a hoax 1969.

Like the 9/11 2001 WTC tower global progressive collapses from top down shown live on five US TV channels. Cannot happen in the real world, i.e. it was another Apollo 11 type hoax. I pay anybody €1M to prove me wrong there too.

You see, I am a generous person. And pls follow the forum rules when replying. Do not shoot at the piano player. Listen to the music and say what's wrong with it.
First of all, why are dissenting views moderated (his and mine)?  That's outright censorship.  Truth does not suffer investigation.  Furthermore it's decidedly Orwellian to use the word "truther" as a derogatory term (I see it a lot.)  What's wrong with seeking the truth?  And I'm a guy who was kicked off one conspiracy forum for being too liberal and proposing the ISS was real!!!

Regarding the million Euro offer, how can someone put up a million Euros when their "company website" is on Tripod?
you are not moderated because your views are dissenting.  you are moderated because you didn't follow the rules.  Show you can follow them and you'll likely get off moderation.
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Offline Jason Thompson

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1187 on: January 27, 2013, 06:20:30 PM »
And I'm a guy who was kicked off one conspiracy forum for being too liberal and proposing the ISS was real!!!

You know, I've just checked that out for myself. Quite apart from the fact that you don't actually appear to have been kicked off the forum at all, do you honestly think that, with all the profanity and abuse you slung around on that board, believing the ISS was real was the only reason they would have 'kicked you out'?

Let me ask you another question: why do you think it is OK to be rude and insulting to people? Why do you think you should be allowed to get away with that rather than being held to rules of civility? Would you talk like that to someone to their face and expect to get away with it scott-free?

If you have the facts on your side, as you claim, why do you need to resort to abuse and rudeness in the first place?
"There's this idea that everyone's opinion is equally valid. My arse! Bloke who was a professor of dentistry for forty years does NOT have a debate with some eejit who removes his teeth with string and a door!"  - Dara O'Briain

Offline JayUtah

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1188 on: January 27, 2013, 08:38:59 PM »
What's wrong with seeking the truth?

Nothing.  Just like there's nothing wrong with going to church.  But if you go to church and pee in the holy water, they kick you out.  They kick you out for peeing in the holy water, not because of "religious differences" or any such ideological nonsense.

If you don't want people to sanction you, quit behaving distastefully.

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And I'm a guy who was kicked off one conspiracy forum for being too liberal and proposing the ISS was real!

Nope.  You showed up with an attitude.  You blatantly admitted that you both gave a dissenting opinion and behaved reprehensibly (i.e., profanity).  Now you want us to believe that the sanctions against you (if any) are for the opinion and not the attitude?  Sorry, that's standard conspiracy rhetoric:  pretend your were "banned for your beliefs."  Every conspiracy theorist tries this.  Nobody buys it.

I see that there as well as here you made lofty claims to engineering expertise and experience that you could not back up.  So do you just go from forum to forum with this same schtick until you get caught?
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams

Offline Echnaton

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1189 on: January 27, 2013, 10:11:28 PM »
First of all, why are dissenting views moderated (his and mine)?  That's outright censorship.  Truth does not suffer investigation.  Furthermore it's decidedly Orwellian to use the word "truther" as a derogatory term (I see it a lot.)  What's wrong with seeking the truth?  And I'm a guy who was kicked off one conspiracy forum for being too liberal and proposing the ISS was real!!!

Yawn.

The whining is the most tedious part of hoax believers.  Whining and whining instead of supporting a hoax theory.
The sun shone, having no alternative, on the nothing new. —Samuel Beckett

Offline Not Myself

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1190 on: January 28, 2013, 01:17:10 AM »
But if you go to church and pee in the holy water, they kick you out.

You didn't learn that the hard way, did you?  ;D
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Offline peter eldergill

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1191 on: January 28, 2013, 11:02:41 PM »
  Just like there's nothing wrong with going to church.  But if you go to church and pee in the holy water, they kick you out.  They kick you out for peeing in the holy water, not because of "religious differences" or any such ideological nonsense.



That sounds like a testable hypothesis to me

Heh

Pete

Offline dwight

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1192 on: January 29, 2013, 07:14:04 PM »
So where is our beloved Heiwa? I think his suspension is up now, isnt it??
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Offline twik

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1193 on: January 30, 2013, 10:08:51 AM »
So where is our beloved Heiwa? I think his suspension is up now, isnt it??

He's over at CosmoQuest, ignoring answers to the questions he's asked.

Offline Not Myself

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1194 on: January 30, 2013, 10:43:25 AM »
So where is our beloved Heiwa? I think his suspension is up now, isnt it??

He's over at CosmoQuest, ignoring answers to the questions he's asked.

Heiwa hasn't logged in there since Jan 23.  Is there a sock?
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Offline Daggerstab

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1195 on: January 30, 2013, 11:15:48 AM »
Forgot to check on Björkman's page for a few days. Latest revision is from today. Again I have no time for a proper diff, just some highlights...

He has finally split the unreadable title into multiple centered lines.

He has also added this to the UFO "argument":

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Reason is that too much fuel was required that could be carried and the pilot maneuvers were impossible to carry out ... and that everything was just a hoax 1969. That people believed. It was easy to fool people 1969. Since the 1940's the public had been told that Flying Saucers, UFOs, were regularly visiting Earth and that the USA could easily do space flying too. No rocket engineers would disagre. They are generally military where everything is secret. But...

The link is to a Bart Sibrel interview with Kaysing... Can't watch it right now, so I'm not sure why it's "but".

The argument is a really stupid one, which is unsurprising. Hey, Heiwa, ever heard of the commercial satellite launching industry? Or geostationary communication satellites are a hoax now, too?

For some inexplicable reason, he has become fixated with another NASA employee, adding a random paragraph about him in the "article"'s introduction:

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So how is it possible that NASA fakes their activities? The person to ask is Terrence W. Wilcutt, NASA's Chief of Safety and Mission Assurance. Terrence heads the Office of Safety and Mission Assurance (OSMA) that assures the safety and enhances the success of all NASA activities through the development, implementation, and oversight of Agencywide safety, reliability, maintainability, and quality assurance (SRM&QA) policies and procedures.

[photo of Wilcutt]

"Wilcutt joined NASA in 1990 as an astronaut candidate and was accepted into the corps in 1991. He logged more than 1,007 hours in space as the pilot on two shuttle  missions, STS-68 in 1994 and STS-79 in 1996, and commander of two others, STS-89 in 1998 and STS-106 in 2000. His  technical assignments as an astronaut included work on space shuttle main engine and external tank issues; supporting shuttle launches and landings as a member of the astronaut support personnel team at NASA’s Kennedy Space Center in Florida; and technical issues for the Astronaut Office Operations Development Branch at Johnson."

It would appear Terrence W. Wilcutt is part of the NASA hoax. Imaging having been 1 007 hrs in space and done four Shuttle re-entries, flying backwards from the Mir station (twice) and ISS (once) like Mark Kelly that I describe below.

Any idea why Wilcutt warrants inclusion? Did someone mention him on CosmoQuest or somewhere else?

Hey, Heiwa, here's something for you - a list of all the people who have flown in space (and returned, one way or the other):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_space_travelers_by_name

Care to add something about each one of them on your page? :D

In the "sources" section, a sentence has been deleted: "This quality and excellence award is no longer (since 2006) given because nobody seems to fulfill the guidelines' conditions ... that are better forgotten."

And another source has been added:

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[5] SATURN V LAUNCH VEHICLE FLIGHT EVALUATION REPORT-AS-.506 APOLLO 11 MISSION (not signed by anybody and probably written by some free-lance science fiction writer 1969)

Yeah, because a grand conspiracy would employ a freelance science-fiction writer instead of someone with the required technical knowledge... Oh, wait, that's another bad attempt at ridicule. ::)

He has now corrected his page to say that the transposition and docking was done after TLI. Something has finally sunk in. :D He still thinks the maneuver was some kind of amazing "stunt" though. Apparently, he's never heard of "relative velocity".

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Apollo 11 with three asstronuts aboard launched from Cape Kennedy on July 16, 09.32 local time, 1969 fitted on top of a hugh, 100 + meter tall three stages, Saturn V, rocket or fire works launch vehicle looking like something right. The original drawings and records how it all worked are lost! Three minutes later the launch escape three motors system on top the CM was jettisoned ... one way or another. Why it was fitted in the first place is not clear.

I'm curious, how many machines from 50 years ago have their whole technical documentation intact... Also, Björkman still doesn't know why a launch escape system is necessary...  :P

(The blue marks modified text - in the previous version, the time was in "G.m.t" ;D )

And now the Saturn V is a fake too:
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Three stages launch vehicle Saturn V with Apollo 11 Command, Service and Lunar landing modules on top. Note the amount of fuel and thrust of the rockets that were required to first put the Apollo 11 modules in orbit around Earth and then to send them off to the Moon. The last use of a Saturn 5 rocket  was the 14 May 1973 launch of Skylab. All drawings what they looked like and records how they worked were then conveniently lost and some people wonder if they ever existed ... or if they were just one empty mock up with some jet engines at bottom and trick film! Then came another strange launch vehicle - the Shuttle - that could not land on Earth after visiting space!

Note that this is the modified caption of the big diagram of the Saturn V, the one with the wrong engine label. That is, he's protesting about the lack of "all drawings what they looked like" in the caption of such a drawing. ;D

Oh, and the proposition that the Saturns were "mockups with jet engines at the bottom and trick film" is laughable. Their launches were public events attended by many people who were direct witnesses of the events from the launch to until the rocket went too high to be visible. The reported power and effects of the engines were much more powerful than anything else existing at the time.

He also mentions dust raised by the descent/ascent engine, linking to this video:


And that pretty much everything of note in the latest update.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2013, 11:23:49 AM by Daggerstab »

Offline raven

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1196 on: January 30, 2013, 11:40:41 AM »
And I suppose the massive pieces of debris that hit Australia, to the considerable embarrassment of NASA, are fake as well. ::)

Offline twik

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1197 on: January 30, 2013, 12:02:54 PM »
(blinks) The Shuttle could not land on Earth?  :o What sort of shuttle would that be, exactly?

Offline Daggerstab

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1198 on: January 30, 2013, 12:43:24 PM »
(blinks) The Shuttle could not land on Earth?  :o What sort of shuttle would that be, exactly?

You haven't been to his page, have you? I suggest you skim it. He believes that nothing can return safely from space - that safe atmospheric re-entry is impossible because all the kinetic energy of a reentering body magically heats only the body itself. Hence the long discussion of heat shields and detached shockwaves earlier in the thread. :D

Offline Count Zero

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Re: So, who wants to win 1 million Euro?
« Reply #1199 on: January 30, 2013, 12:54:27 PM »
Oh, and the proposition that the Saturns were "mockups with jet engines at the bottom and trick film" is laughable. Their launches were public events attended by many people who were direct witnesses of the events from the launch to until the rocket went too high to be visible.

Me, for example (see my avatar).

(blinks) The Shuttle could not land on Earth?  :o What sort of shuttle would that be, exactly?

According to Heiwa, there's no such thing as heat-shields, so atmospheric re-entry is impossible and therefore the Space Shuttle was a hoax.  See earlier in this thread (because I would rather empty a litter-box than wade through this again).
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