Radiation

[Abaddon]

OK just for shiggles I plotted a route from Flight Club, NYc to the NYC transit museum.

Then I grabbed the results in top down and side on views.

[molesworth]

There is a distinct inability in this group to shift their perspectives from a 3 dimensional point of view and I think it is the basis of the lack of comprehension.  It is frustrating to deal with the spatially challenged.

I'm inclined (pun intended) to think you're just trolling now.  This is entirely a 3D matter, and while 2D representations can help, you need to consider multiple 2D views of the situation.

Hence :

When viewed from a 2d top view looking down on the north pole the VAB appears as a ring completely surrounding the earth starting at about 600 miles out.  Any and all elliptical orbits greater than a 600 mile radius must pass through this ring.  It would be obvious to the casual observer, that is if that observer is capable of spatially interpreting a two dimensional drawing.

Again, a lack of rigour, or understanding...

Looking down from the north geomagnetic pole the VAB appears as a ring.  A plane at right angles to the polar axis intersects the belt region with symmetrical contours of radiation levels.

When viewed from the physical pole the ring is distorted, and a perpendicular plane intersects varying regions of activity.

Add to that the inclination of the Apollo 11 orbit, which you've been shown on Bob Braeunig's page, and you have a complex 3D system of volumes and trajectories which you cannot represent in a trivial 2D diagram.

Apparently 3D animations, and even physical 3D models aren't helping you to visualise this at all 

[Mag40]

There is a distinct inability in this group to shift their perspectives from a 3 dimensional point of view and I think it is the basis of the lack of comprehension.  It is frustrating to deal with the spatially challenged.

Whoever you are and whatever your motive, your responses are often both childish and very ignorant. I gave you a 2D drawing showing quite clearly how your claim the two routes the same is hopeless. You are afraid to admit your painful blunders and are just obfuscating to cover the public humiliation inflicted on you.

You gave some weird hybrid containing an ellipse from a top view and a side view of the VAB.  Give me a top view of both to put them in the proper perspective.

I gave you a view perpendicular to the 30 degree inclination. Your confusion is either you trolling or you are even more ignorant than you appear to be.



The Apollo speed takes it into the VAB at the same elevation but not the same place. It's called 3D
To further add to this nonsense, the Apollo TLI burns specifically fired to accentuate the position of the magnetic pole on the opposite side of the Earth, to achieve even more elevation(relative to the belts). I have no reason to suppose that Orion did that or any reason for doing so.

[Abaddon]

Oh we are into a strange far country where dimensions do not exist, a far silver shore and then all turns to silvered glass. And then you see it.

[Luke Pemberton]

Oh we are into a strange far country where dimensions do not exist, a far silver shore and then all turns to silvered glass. And then you see it.

Shall we introduce the time like dimension now, or shall we save for later? We could begin writing the trajectory in Einstein notation using geocentric basis vectors with a transformation matrix for the geomagnetic vectors.

Sent from my G3311 using Tapatalk

[Abaddon]

Oh we are into a strange far country where dimensions do not exist, a far silver shore and then all turns to silvered glass. And then you see it.

Shall we introduce the time like dimension now, or shall we save for later? We could begin writing the trajectory in Einstein notation using geocentric basis vectors with a transformation matrix for the geomagnetic vectors.

Sent from my G3311 using Tapatalk

Iluvatar says no.

[bknight]

...

I'm inclined (pun intended) to think you're just trolling now.  This is entirely a 3D matter, and while 2D representations can help, you need to consider multiple 2D views of the situation.

Hence :

When viewed from a 2d top view looking down on the north pole the VAB appears as a ring completely surrounding the earth starting at about 600 miles out.  Any and all elliptical orbits greater than a 600 mile radius must pass through this ring.  It would be obvious to the casual observer, that is if that observer is capable of spatially interpreting a two dimensional drawing.

Again, a lack of rigour, or understanding...

Looking down from the north geomagnetic pole the VAB appears as a ring.  A plane at right angles to the polar axis intersects the belt region with symmetrical contours of radiation levels.

When viewed from the physical pole the ring is distorted, and a perpendicular plane intersects varying regions of activity.

Add to that the inclination of the Apollo 11 orbit, which you've been shown on Bob Braeunig's page, and you have a complex 3D system of volumes and trajectories which you cannot represent in a trivial 2D diagram.

Apparently 3D animation s, and even physical 3D models aren't helping you to visualise this at all 

Excellent summation.

[timfinch]

How do you like this rendition?

[Mag40]

How do you like this rendition?

Don't evade the points made. Your picture shows two elliptical orbits, they are different to each other. How in any way does that support your untenable claim?

BTW - Your userid is no longer suspended at CQ, I suggest you answer the questions there if you start up. I am 100% certain your antics here will be known about over there and will not be tolerated.

[Abaddon]

Shall we introduce the time like dimension now, or shall we save for later? We could begin writing the trajectory in Einstein notation using geocentric basis vectors with a transformation matrix for the geomagnetic vectors.

To post a more serious answer...No? If as seems evident TF literally finds the search for a method of determining his way out of the proverbial papery container, any discussion of SR or GR or QM seems sort of moot. Geometry is demonstrably outside his understanding. If it is, as seems demonstraed, beyond TF's ability to understand a mere three dimensions then it is no use chucking a forth fifth and subsequent dimensions into the mix. String theory supports 26.

I retract that. It would actually be hilarious to see that happen.

[bknight]

How do you like this rendition?

What is your point?  From this perspective the amount of vertical distance above the VARB is not shown.

[timfinch]

It can clearly be seen that both elliptical orbits pass through the inner ring.  A side view reals that each plane of the ellipticals are identical.  As a consequence the passage through the High radiation inner ring should have similar profiles.  This being the case then the Orion EFT's data set can be extrapolated out to the apollo.

[Abaddon]

How do you like this rendition?

Personally, I like it a lot as it illustrates how wrong you really are.

[Abaddon]

It can clearly be seen that both elliptical orbits pass through the inner ring.  A side view reals that each plane of the ellipticals are identical.  As a consequence the passage through the High radiation inner ring should have similar profiles.  This being the case then the Orion EFT's data set can be extrapolated out to the apollo.

Oooo, new image ahead.

[timfinch]

How do you like this rendition?

Don't evade the points made. Your picture shows two elliptical orbits, they are different to each other. How in any way does that support your untenable claim?

BTW - Your userid is no longer suspended at CQ, I suggest you answer the questions there if you start up. I am 100% certain your antics here will be known about over there and will not be tolerated.

I remind you that they not only suspended me, they closed the thread to prevent anyone else from speculating along the lines of inquiry I had introduced.  Cosmoquest is not interested in any version but their own.  It is a waste of my time.