Author Topic: Trump will win?  (Read 63346 times)

Offline alvarez

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #225 on: December 10, 2016, 04:58:24 PM »
How is the right any different? They think all of their ideas are gold... until they aren't, and then it's the other guy's fault. "We're going to invade Iraq and they will greet us as liberators." Yeah... how'd that turn out?

It seems to be almost universally accepted these days that the whole thing was a giant catastrophe, which may be why Madame Patriot Act has been trying to disown her vote for that particular war since at least 2005.

Offline alvarez

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #226 on: December 10, 2016, 05:50:59 PM »
I'm sure we will be opening more refugee camps for scared American expats soon. Maybe they can get a "Welcome to Canada" briefing from some of the Syrian refugees we've taken in.

If those American expats think their former government is going to leave them alone just because they've left the US proper for a colony, they're out of their f***ing minds.  They can run away to the jungles of Cambodia, and they will still find the American government has crawled up their arses even further than when they were living in the US.

I have a feeling they're also going to be rather underwhelmed by the lack of Canadian enthusiasm for the presence of a group of such incredibly awesome people as themselves.

So let us imagine how this journey will go.  A bunch of people, many of whom supported Obama for eight years and then voted for Clinton, will declare, "Remember when we didn't care how many evil foreigners were being exterminated, as long as we got what we wanted?  We still don't care how many foreigners are killed, but now we're not getting what we want!  This is not some minor unimportant issue like foreigners getting blown apart - we have to live under Trump!"  So they pack up their empathy-free bubbles, and head off to - not one of the numerous countries where they've been dropping democracy from the sky in 500-pound metal containers, but Canada.  Clearly, what's good enough for the inferior races isn't good enough for them.

Karmic justice will have thus bitten them in the arse once already, but they may find it isn't done with them yet.

First, they will have to get to Canada.  How will they get there?  If they fly, they might get to the airport and discover that the Trump has used one of the powers he inherited from the Great, Wise, and Benevolent Obama to prevent them from flying.  How does one get on the no-fly list?  No one is really sure, it's secret.  How does one get off of it?  One doesn't, really.  Well, possibly.  One could ask politely to the great dictatorship in Washington, "Oh please, glorious, all-powerful, all-knowing, and all-holy government, I'm a good person, please let me fly?  When I had no problem at all with you having dictatorial powers to punish any person you like by refusing to let them fly, I thought you were only going to use this power against people I don't like!  I didn't think you were going to use it against holy self-righteous people like me!"  Well, perhaps they ought to leave the last part out - challenging the government tends not to end well for the challenger in police states.  So if one is sufficiently obsequious and grovels well enough, perhaps one will get off the list.  What's that you say?  Go to court and challenge it?  Surely that is some kind of joke?

So, if their grovelling is unsuccessful, or if they just don't feel like waiting a few years to see whether the government will, in its munificence, decide to allow them to fly, maybe they can all take a bus together.  Obviously it will have to be a special reinforced bus to be able to withstand the internal pressure from carrying so much holiness and righteousness.  But, they will still need a passport to get to Canada, and another particular bit of karmic justice might bite them in the arse here.  Well, this one is more debatable, since the Great, Wise, and Benevolent Obama didn't enact this one until after 2012, so they could plausibly claim they didn't vote for it.  That's a rather convenient fact, isn't it?  But, the Trump may decide to use another one of the powers he inherits from the GBW Obama, and cancel their passports.  Under recent legislation, all it takes to cancel their passports is an allegation of unpaid taxes - no proof, no court hearing, the IRS just has to say so.  They could spend thousands of dollars and years in court fighting to get it back, and perhaps even be successful, although it's not clear what would prevent the IRS from revoking the passport again the very next day.  Just imagine their outrage - "I only support confiscation of passports without due process from people I don't like!  How dare the government confiscate my passport!"  Well, fair enough, maybe they can claim they didn't actually support this one.

Should they avoid, or circumvent, these two obstacles, they can board the bus and head off to Canada.  Perhaps the Trump will know they are going, having used the incredibly comprehensive electronic surveillance powers he will inherit from the GWB Obama.  One can only imagine their outrage once again - "I support spying on other people, not on me!"  And perhaps their concern over this spying will be justified, if the Trump decides to blast them straight to hell, using the powers of universal assassination he will inherit from the GWB Obama.  Once again, imagine their outrage during their last seconds of life, as they see the missile streaking towards them, and they shout, "This is the greatest injustice in the history of the world!  I only supported terrorism for eight years (or longer) because I thought only people I didn't like would be killed!  How dare they kill a supporter of terrorism like me!"  And they and their empathy-free bubbles would then be torn apart rather violently.  How awful.

Should they avoid all of these particular forms of karmic justice, and manage to get to Canada, they might then notice that there aren't long queues of people waiting to give free blow jobs to these incredibly awesome, holy, and righteous newcomers, and be surprised that there are so many Trump supporters in Canada.  But no matter, their troubles are almost over, at least until they try to open a bank account.  Or buy a prepaid fare card for the Toronto transit system.  Or try to engage in any one of a number of other actions that are perfectly legal from people from every country in the world, except those from "the land of the free".  So a lot of the advice they receive from the Syrian refugees won't apply, since Syrians have many freedoms Americans don't - the GWB Obama signed legislation in his first term that imposed serious economic sanctions on any country in the world that did not discriminate against Americans, although this did not keep too many people from voting him a second term.  But, they will now discover to their sorrow, that the US was not content to be a police state within its borders, but needed to be the dictatorship of the entire world.  And exercising the right to kill anyone anytime for no reason at all was not enough - imposing its regulation extraterritorially on the entire world (the US justification for going to war against the UK in 1812) was also necessary.  So these Americans will find that they have trouble opening a bank account, as many Canadian banks don't want to take the risk of running afoul of the extensive, complex regulations from the global regulatory authorities in Washington.  Opening a securities account will be essentially impossible.  They will have to file US taxes, just like they always did, but they'll also have to report their prepaid Toronto transit fare card not once, but twice a year, to the US government.  Failure to do so is a felony - well the US needs to make sure they're not using that fare card for money laundering purposes.  That seems quite reasonable, doesn't it?  The person who was fined for failure to pay American taxes on the Canadian disability pension she was receiving for her mentally handicapped son might have something to say about this.  She might also have something to say about how she can't escape these difficult, expensive, reporting requirements, because her son, being mentally handicapped, lacks the requisite cognitive capacity to relinquish his US citizenship under US law.  So just imagine the outrage our American refugees feel when they find this particular law passed by the GWB Obama in his first term bites them in the arse.  They'll be so enraged the empathy-free bubbles they live in might even burst.

They could ask the bus to stop at the American embassy so they can give up their US citizenship, an absolutely necessary step for living a normal life.  This process is expensive, time-consuming, and difficult - we might suspect the US would bomb China if it had such an expatriation process.  (From what I've heard, it doesn't - China seems to have quite a lot of freedoms the US doesn't.)  Last I heard, the waiting period was over a year.  Maybe it's shorter now.

So what do you think?  Within a few years, would these American refugees have assimilated themselves into and made their mark on Canadian society?  Would Canada be bombing the crap out of the rest of the world, conducting assassinations, detaining people for years without trial, and doing all the other sorts of things they supported under the GWB Obama?  (Maybe Obama could become the Prime Minister of Canada!)  Of would they be allied with Trump, demanding that he "fight for their freedom", bomb Ottawa, invade Canada, and possibly annex it?
« Last Edit: December 10, 2016, 06:08:05 PM by alvarez »

Offline gwiz

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #227 on: December 11, 2016, 06:11:48 AM »
He's very rich, he can afford the best accountants and the best lawyers, so yes he can get away with it.

I don't know whether you're very rich or not, but if you are and have that attitude, I wouldn't be surprised if there were a lot of jail time in your future.

If you can be jailed for expressing cynicism about the ability of the rich to avoid tax, things are worse than I thought.
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Offline twik

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #228 on: December 13, 2016, 11:16:05 AM »
I'm still amazed at why alvarez has come to a board he's never contributed to before to rant against Clinton, while ignoring Trump.

Alvarez, I'm asking you straight out - what is your interest in Apollohoax? Did you come here because of any interest at all in our primary subject matter, or do you simply scan websites looking for people who don't like Trump, and spend your time tu quoquing them?

Offline gillianren

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #229 on: December 13, 2016, 11:57:12 AM »
And frankly, it take a lot of doing to me to condemn Clinton for corruption while coincidentally ignoring that there's increasingly clear evidence of a foreign power's interfering in the election process on Trump's behalf.
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Offline twik

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #230 on: December 13, 2016, 04:26:14 PM »
I should remind alvarez that you are required on this board to answer direct questions, even if the answer "I don't know." So, I'd like my question answered, please.

Offline Peter B

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #231 on: December 15, 2016, 06:39:38 PM »
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-12-14/opinion-donald-trump-conflicts-of-interest/8095842

This is an interesting (and worrying) article about Trump's conflicts of interest between his business interests and the US national interest. In particular, it draws attention to a clause in the US Constitution about Presidential emoluments, along with his indebtedness to a bank which is in the process of being fined by the US Government for its lending practices.

Quote
Trump has borrowed up to $2.5 billion from Deutsche Bank in the last 20 years. The US Department of Justice is currently negotiating a settlement of up to $14 billion with the bank as a penalty for its predatory lending practices in the lead-up to the global financial crisis.

The settlement will be overseen by the incoming attorney-general, whom Trump will personally appoint.

The irony here should not be lost on us. Trump lambasted Hillary Clinton throughout the campaign for being effectively indebted to the large financial institutions that brought down the US economy in 2008. Trump, on the other hand, is literally indebted to them.

My bolding.
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Offline Peter B

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #232 on: December 16, 2016, 07:05:40 AM »
[snip]

They could ask the bus to stop at the American embassy so they can give up their US citizenship, an absolutely necessary step for living a normal life.  This process is expensive, time-consuming, and difficult...

??

From what I've read, you go to a US Embassy or Consulate, and in the presence of an official at the post sign a form renouncing citizenship. What is expensive, time-consuming or difficult about that?

Quote
...we might suspect the US would bomb China if it had such an expatriation process.  (From what I've heard, it doesn't - China seems to have quite a lot of freedoms the US doesn't.)

That's nice. Which freedoms would these be?
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Offline twik

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #233 on: December 16, 2016, 10:08:49 AM »
[snip]

They could ask the bus to stop at the American embassy so they can give up their US citizenship, an absolutely necessary step for living a normal life.  This process is expensive, time-consuming, and difficult...

??

From what I've read, you go to a US Embassy or Consulate, and in the presence of an official at the post sign a form renouncing citizenship. What is expensive, time-consuming or difficult about that?


Apparently the application has to be reviewed by a U.S. district court to ensure that the renunciation doesn't make the applicant stateless, so it wouldn't be immediate. But it appears that this would be processed by the government, and not have to be pursued by the applicant.

Offline twik

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #234 on: December 23, 2016, 05:04:40 PM »
Aaaaaaand when asked to explain why he was on this particular part of the forum and no other, Alvarez suddenly lost interest.

Offline Peter B

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #235 on: January 20, 2017, 09:15:51 AM »
[snip]

They could ask the bus to stop at the American embassy so they can give up their US citizenship, an absolutely necessary step for living a normal life.  This process is expensive, time-consuming, and difficult...

??

From what I've read, you go to a US Embassy or Consulate, and in the presence of an official at the post sign a form renouncing citizenship. What is expensive, time-consuming or difficult about that?

Quote
...we might suspect the US would bomb China if it had such an expatriation process.  (From what I've heard, it doesn't - China seems to have quite a lot of freedoms the US doesn't.)

That's nice. Which freedoms would these be?

Say, Alvarez, seeing as you're back, would you mind answering these questions?
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Offline Glom

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #236 on: January 20, 2017, 10:27:43 AM »
I happen to be back from work early because I finished up my work and was spluttering and sneezing everywhere so I guess I'll watch the coverage in half an hour. I missed Theresa May driving down the Mall do I guess I'll catch this instead.

Offline gillianren

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #237 on: January 20, 2017, 11:57:15 AM »
I can't.  I just can't.  I've got a lot of friends around the country who are marching tomorrow, though.
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Offline Peter B

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #238 on: January 21, 2017, 02:54:59 AM »
I can't.  I just can't.  I've got a lot of friends around the country who are marching tomorrow, though.

With the greatest of respect, I hope none of them were involved in violent protest.

I mean, I fully support people having their say (doing so is better protected in the USA than here in Australia), but the reports I've seen of damage to private property and assaults on people (coward-punched while being interviewed on TV, no less) are not going to do anything to garner sympathy.
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Offline LunarOrbit

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Re: Trump will win?
« Reply #239 on: January 21, 2017, 10:44:53 AM »
I have no sympathy for the guy that was coward-punched while being interviewed on TV seeing that he is a neo-nazi scumbag. But yeah, I don't agree with the property damage.
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