ApolloHoax.net
Apollo Discussions => The Hoax Theory => Topic started by: apollo_deception on April 14, 2013, 10:15:48 AM
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Remember what Brian O'leary said "it is possible for NASA to fake some pictures"
ApolloHoax.net Forum people. What is your take on this? :)
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Remember that Brian O'Leary was quoted out of context.
For NASA to have faked 'some' pictures they must have some genuine pictures. In that case:
a) why fake any pictures at all?
b) how could they have perfectly matched the fake and genuine images?
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with the virtually endless budget NASA had it is possible for them to fake it
i mean come on, its the government for christs sake lol
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with the virtually endless budget NASA had it is possible for them to fake it
1: They didn't have a 'virtually endless' budget. They were fighting for every penny and seeing it cut three years before the first landing.
2: It was not possible to fake it, and in any case I asked how. As I said in another thread, no-one has yet managed to explain how it was faked. Vague assertions that it was possible are not adequate.
3: If they had the ability to fake it, they could have actually gone to the Moon, and since that one would not rely on covering up a massive hoax for decades, with the risk of political embarrassment that goes with that if it is ever uncovered, I know which I'd go for if I had the resources to either fake it or do it for real.
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with the virtually endless budget NASA had it is possible for them to fake it
i mean come on, its the government for christs sake lol
Wow. The virtually unlimited budget assumption stated flat out in the fourth post. At least you are being straightforward with the assumption instead of embedding it in your arguments and begging the question. No, there never was a virtually unlimited budget.
And to answer your more oblique point, no the government cannot hide every it chooses to because there is no "the government" in the sense of a unified monolithic entity.
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Echnaton: I said "virturally endless" cause with 150 billion dollar budget, id call that pretty much endless money in 1969 dollars lol
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if i had 150 billion to spend on a project lord knows id put it to good use designing the best space craft, not some aluminum lined tin can apollo was
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with the virtually endless budget NASA had it is possible for them to fake it
With virtually endless budget they could go to the moon instead.
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Echnaton: I said "virturally endless" cause with 150 billion dollar budget, id call that pretty much endless money in 1969 dollars lol
Endless relative to the cost of space exploration in 1969? What about other projects? The NASA budget for 1969 was $21,376 million in 2007 dollars. By 1969 the NASA budget had dropped by about one third compared to just three years before.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budget_of_NASA#Annual_budget.2C_1958-2012
So lets stop using histrionics and start making arguments in the proper context shall we.
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if i had 150 billion to spend on a project lord knows id put it to good use designing the best space craft, not some aluminum lined tin can apollo was
And your expertise in spacecraft design that leads you to this statement is what?
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Remember what Astronaut Brian O'leary said "it is possible for NASA to fake some pictures"
ApolloHoax.net Forum people. What is your take on this? :)
Brian O'Leary was not an astronaut.
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Apollo_deception, check out this link to get more detail about O'Leary.
http://www.clavius.org/oleary.html (http://www.clavius.org/oleary.html)
Also, please consider using appropriate grammar and punctuation. It would make your posts easier to read.
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts....show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts....show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
The crews of Gemini 10 and 11 entered the Van Allen belts on their flights. The astronauts on the ISS travel through the South Atlantic Anomaly on a regular basis and survive. Were you aware of this, or are you saying those flights were/are faked too?
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts....show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
The crews of Gemini 10 and 11 entered the Van Allen belts on their flights. The astronauts on the ISS travel through the South Atlantic Anomaly on a regular basis and survive. Were you aware of this, or are you saying those flights were/are faked too?
well considering people believed everything they heard and saw on television back then its possible
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Remember what Astronaut Brian O'leary said "it is possible for NASA to fake some pictures"
ApolloHoax.net Forum people. What is your take on this? :)
Brian O'leary was not an astronaut.
NASA claims him as an astronaut because he had completed the selection process and moved into training. The fact that he quit before being qualified for a mission is relevant only if one considers going into space as being a requirement. But being a NASA astronaut is a purely matter of employment classification.
OTOH, apollo_deception's claim that O'Leary had some special insight to a hoax is simply an appeal to authority fallacy.
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well considering people believed everything they heard and saw on television back then its possible
No, they didn't. What's your source for that? By this statement, I think we can take it as read that you weren't around then, so how do you know? Do you just believe what someone told you?
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts....show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
The crews of Gemini 10 and 11 entered the Van Allen belts on their flights. The astronauts on the ISS travel through the South Atlantic Anomaly on a regular basis and survive. Were you aware of this, or are you saying those flights were/are faked too?
well considering people believed everything they heard and saw on television back then its possible
The Russians sent biological specimens (turtles and insects) through the Van Allen belts and returned them to Earth alive. Did you know that?
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts....show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
Don't shift the burden of proof. It is your claim, you prove it.
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well considering people believed everything they heard and saw on television back then its possible
No, they didn't. What's your source for that? By this statement, I think we can take it as read that you weren't around then, so how do you know? Do you just believe what someone told you?
Evidently he does and is just applying his lack of imagination to the everything else. The late 60's were a hotbed of anti-government sentiment and distrust.
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well considering people believed everything they heard and saw on television back then its possible
And your basis for that assertion is what, exactly?
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts....show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
Oh, the 'deadly' van Allen belts. I await your demonstration of a detailed understanding of the radiation types, flux density, intensity and so on, and the ways of shielding against the types of radiation in the belts. Also i await your demonstrated expertise in how to navigate in space to show how it would be impossible to avoid them, or at least the most intense parts of them.
Or are you just spouting the same old uncritical nonsense we always hear about the van Allen belts?
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts....show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
Oh, the 'deadly' van Allen belts. I await your demonstration of a detailed understanding of the radiation types, flux density, intensity and so on, and the ways of shielding against the types of radiation in the belts. Also i await your demonstrated expertise in how to navigate in space to show how it would be impossible to avoid them, or at least the most intense parts of them.
Or are you just spouting the same old uncritical nonsense we always hear about the van Allen belts?
Yes he is and when he realises he will get nowhere with it he will just post another thread with another marvellous 'truth' about the big hoax!
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts....show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
The crews of Gemini 10 and 11 entered the Van Allen belts on their flights. The astronauts on the ISS travel through the South Atlantic Anomaly on a regular basis and survive. Were you aware of this, or are you saying those flights were/are faked too?
well considering people believed everything they heard and saw on television back then its possible
And? Even if that was true. and people did believe everything on TV, how does that demonstrate that something wasn't true?
Your OP asks if they went but faked only some of the pictures. This makes your suggestion that no-one went through the VAB a bit dumb doesn't it?
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they just recently found a 3rd belt of radiation that exists
i dont see how aluminum can shield radiation?
its said you need at least 2 feet of lead for protection. but think of how difficult it would be to launch a massive lead space craft into orbit lol
pretty dang hard considering it hasnt been done
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I suspect that this poll is a trap. Most will choose the "faked no pictures" option, and at some point the OP will show some altered NASA PR pic, thus proving that pro-Apollo people are sheeple who believe everything they are told by the government.
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no I'm a skeptic. i don't know for sure what happened. and quite frankly i don't think anyone in this forum knows for sure exactly what happened on July 20Th 1969
all i know is a lot of stuff doesn't add up
that we all can agree on, correct?
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they just recently found a 3rd belt of radiation that exists
And? What were its properties that led to it being undiscovered until now? Could it be that it just wasn't intense enough to show up before? In which case, who cares?
i dont see how aluminum can shield radiation?
Well your lack of knowledge of the relevant physics is your problem, not ours. To begin with, do you understand that 'radiation' is not a single phenomenon but there are various types with different properties?
its said you need at least 2 feet of lead for protection
Said by whom regarding what kind of radiation of what intensity for what duration? The statement 'you need two feet of lead to protect against radiation' is meaningless.
but think of how difficult it would be to launch a massive lead space craft into orbit
Yes it would indeed, but since it wasn't necessary who cares how hard it would be?
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well considering people believed everything they heard and saw on television back then its possible
I don't agree that's true. In any case, what about the legions of scientists and engineers since then who don't get their information from television and who unanimously believe the Apollo missions were real?
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all i know is a lot of stuff doesn't add up
that we all can agree on, correct?
Incorrect. What doesn't add up for you is not necessarily a problem for anyone else. You have already demonstrated a very poor understanding of radiation, so why should we believe you know much about any of the technical fields relating to Apollo? But there are plenty of people who DO understand it, many of them here on this board, and they don't find anything anomalous.
The problem is not that stuff doesn't add up, it's that you don't understand how it adds up.
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I suspect that this poll is a trap. Most will choose the "faked no pictures" option, and at some point the OP will show some altered NASA PR pic, thus proving that pro-Apollo people are sheeple who believe everything they are told by the government.
no trap, im just a curious, intellectual person who is trying to get to the bottom of this anomaly we call "Apollo"
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Your posting style and thus far demonstrated level of understanding does not fit well with your claim to be 'intellectual'...
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...i don't think anyone in this forum knows for sure exactly what happened...
Don't speak for me.
all i know is a lot of stuff doesn't add up
Is that belief informed? Or do you simply not know personally how things were done.
that we all can agree on, correct?
I don't agree at all. I'm an engineer with 20+ years of experience in aerospace design and operations, including work on real spacecraft. I have studied the Apollo missions extensively and am considered an expert on the subject. If you tell me they are fake, I require you to prove it. Can you do that?
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they just recently found a 3rd belt of radiation that exists
So, wouldn't the late discovery give you some clue about the radiation intensity in that belt?
i dont see how aluminum can shield radiation?
That's obvious. Would you believe that a sheet of paper can shield you from radiation?
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all i know is a lot of stuff doesn't add up
that we all can agree on, correct?
Incorrect. What doesn't add up for you is not necessarily a problem for anyone else. You have already demonstrated a very poor understanding of radiation, so why should we believe you know much about any of the technical fields relating to Apollo? But there are plenty of people who DO understand it, many of them here on this board, and they don't find anything anomalous.
The problem is not that stuff doesn't add up, it's that you don't understand how it adds up.
ok for one i dont appreciate you insulting me im not an idiot i am just asking questions
so please be polite and try having a civil discussion without throwing snarky comments out there like that thank you!
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts...
Not according to the man who discovered them. Dr. Van Allen specifically repudiated the hoax theories on that basis.
show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
Gemini missions. Why does it have to be a manned mission? We operate unmanned spacecraft routinely within the Van Allen belts for lengthy missions of several years. They are just as susceptible to radiation, and unlike a human organism they cannot heal themselves.
If the Van Allen belts are so deadly, why are the hoax theorists unable to come up with a single qualified scientist or engineer who endorses the idea of hoaxed missions? Why do they all unanimously believe the Apollo missions were real?
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with the virtually endless budget NASA had it is possible for them to fake it
i mean come on, its the government for christs sake lol
Ah, the old contradictory belief system of a conspiracy theorist.
"The government can do anything... except go to the Moon!"
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ok for one i dont appreciate you insulting me im not an idiot i am just asking questions
so please be polite and try having a civil discussion without throwing snarky comments out there like that thank you!
You're calling people in my profession liars. I don't think you have any room for discomfort. You can either prove your accusation with facts, or you cannot. So far it's evident you cannot. So stop with the faux indignance and support your claims.
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...i don't think anyone in this forum knows for sure exactly what happened...
Don't speak for me.
all i know is a lot of stuff doesn't add up
Is that belief informed? Or do you simply not know personally how things were done.
that we all can agree on, correct?
I don't agree at all. I'm an engineer with 20+ years of experience in aerospace design and operations, including work on real spacecraft. I have studied the Apollo missions extensively and am considered an expert on the subject. If you tell me they are fake, I require you to prove it. Can you do that?
thats just it, nobody can prove the landings were real. unless you went there and looked at the stuff with your own eyes
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if i had 150 billion to spend on a project lord knows id put it to good use designing the best space craft, not some aluminum lined tin can apollo was
Okay, I'll bite. As I said, I'm a professional aerospace engineer. This is what I do for a living. I consider the Apollo spacecraft to be masterpieces of the field. You seem to think otherwise.
So please tell us what, in your eminently learned opinion, a "best space craft" should have looked like and how it should have functioned. And spare no detail; this is what I do for a living and I will be rigorously quizzing your answer.
Put up or shut up.
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ok for one i dont appreciate you insulting me im not an idiot i am just asking questions
I did not call you an idiot. However, you have demostrated a lack of understanding. If you don't like being told that then that's really your problem.
so please be polite and try having a civil discussion without throwing snarky comments out there like that thank you!
Pointing out where your understanding fails is not snarky, it is factual. You don't understand how aluminium can shield radiation. Well fine, but that is a problem with your understanding, not with any claim that aluminium can shield radiation. I know it can because I have seen it do so. In school. I have sene paper shield against radiation.
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ok for one i dont appreciate you insulting me im not an idiot i am just asking questions
so please be polite and try having a civil discussion without throwing snarky comments out there like that thank you!
You're calling people in my profession liars. I don't think you have any room for discomfort. You can either prove your accusation with facts, or you cannot. So far it's evident you cannot. So stop with the faux indignance and support your claims.
im not out to prove anything. i just want to have a normal conversation with "normal" people.....geesh lol
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thats just it, nobody can prove the landings were real. unless you went there and looked at the stuff with your own eyes
Nonsense. Do you doubt every historical event you didn't personally witness?
I'm challenging your intellect. Show it to us.
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thats just it, nobody can prove the landings were real. unless you went there and looked at the stuff with your own eyes
Fortunately, proving they are real is not our burden of proof. If you claim they are faked then it is your burden to prove they were faked, because that, if true, can be done.
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if i had 150 billion to spend on a project lord knows id put it to good use designing the best space craft, not some aluminum lined tin can apollo was
so aluminum foil was the best the u.s. governement can do with billions of dollars at their disposal?
Okay, I'll bite. As I said, I'm a professional aerospace engineer. This is what I do for a living. I consider the Apollo spacecraft to be masterpieces of the field. You seem to think otherwise.
So please tell us what, in your eminently learned opinion, a "best space craft" should have looked like and how it should have functioned. And spare no detail; this is what I do for a living and I will be rigorously quizzing your answer.
Put up or shut up.
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im not out to prove anything. i just want to have a normal conversation with "normal" people.....geesh lol
Would it be so hard to use proper capitalization and punctuation in your conversation?
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im not out to prove anything. i just want to have a normal conversation with "normal" people.....geesh lol
Nope. You're proposing conspiracy theories, suggesting that they are rational and logical, and asking for answers to them. This is a forum for debate.
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thats just it, nobody can prove the landings were real. unless you went there and looked at the stuff with your own eyes
Fortunately, proving they are real is not our burden of proof. If you claim they are faked then it is your burden to prove they were faked, because that, if true, can be done.
look at all the footage theres my evidence i should have to present the evidence its all for public viewing online
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look at all the footage theres my evidence i should have to present the evidence its all for public viewing online
No, you have to present what it is about that footage that shows it was fake. And by the way I have looked at ALL the footage. I very much doubt you have.
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im not out to prove anything. i just want to have a normal conversation with "normal" people.....geesh lol
Would it be so hard to use proper capitalization and punctuation in your conversation?
im just typing. you can read without punctuation right?
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Why don't you link to specific pieces of footage and then explain in detail what is wrong with them?
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so aluminum foil was the best the u.s. governement can do with billions of dollars at their disposal?
There is no "aluminum foil" on any Apollo spacecraft. Is that the best you can come up with? You're speaking to an expert and telling him his profession is bogus. You're going to have to do a lot better than that. If you can't speak intelligently about the design of spacecraft and the detailed construction of the Apollo spacecraft in particular, then you are in way over your head.
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look at all the footage theres my evidence i should have to present the evidence its all for public viewing online
I have, and I daresay you have not.
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im not out to prove anything. i just want to have a normal conversation with "normal" people.....geesh lol
Would it be so hard to use proper capitalization and punctuation in your conversation?
im just typing. you can read without punctuation right?
Proper grammar and punctuation are appreciated on this forum. It shouldn't be hard for an intellectual like you to post in a coherent manner.
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im just typing. you can read without punctuation right?
So what's so hard about using it for you then? Everyone else seems to manage it. You claim to be intellectual. Prove it. Proper grammar and punctuation is one such way of doing so.
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look at all the footage theres my evidence i should have to present the evidence its all for public viewing online
OK here's my anomaly, the lack of tire tracks underneath the rover, no blast crater, astronauts walking oddly, the shadows, background, yadda yadda yadda...theres my evidence. happy now?
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im just typing. you can read without punctuation right?
So what's so hard about using it for you then? Everyone else seems to manage it. You claim to be intellectual. Prove it. Proper grammar and punctuation is one such way of doing so.
yawn!
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OK here's my anomaly, the lack of tire tracks underneath the rover, no blast crater, astronauts walking oddly, the shadows, background, yadda yadda yadda...theres my evidence. happy now?
Ah, the usual rubbish. You do realise all this has been thoroughly debunked many many times over years and years and years, right?
So no, I'm not happy, because that is not presenting evidence. What is wrong with the shadows, or the way the astronauts walk? Why should there be a blast crater under the LM? Come on, real evidence please.
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OK here's my anomaly, the lack of tire tracks underneath the rover, no blast crater, astronauts walking oddly, the shadows, background, yadda yadda yadda...theres my evidence. happy now?
Ah, the usual rubbish. You do realise all this has been thoroughly debunked many many times over years and years and years, right?
So no, I'm not happy, because that is not presenting evidence. What is wrong with the shadows, or the way the astronauts walk? Why should there be a blast crater under the LM? Come on, real evidence please.
is it possible to have a normal conversation in this forum?
i feel like im on trial lol
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is it possible to have a normal conversation in this forum?
i feel like im on trial lol
This is a normal conversation. You are claiming Apollo was fake, we are asking you to substantiate that claim. What's abnormal about that?
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OK here's my anomaly, the lack of tire tracks underneath the rover, no blast crater, astronauts walking oddly, the shadows, background, yadda yadda yadda...theres my evidence. happy now?
As Jason said, the standard rubbish. Here's my web site. http://www.clavius.org . Let me know when you've worked your way through it. Those claims were all debunked more than 10 years ago.
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look at all the footage theres my evidence i should have to present the evidence its all for public viewing online
OK here's my anomaly, the lack of tire tracks underneath the rover, no blast crater, astronauts walking oddly, the shadows, background, yadda yadda yadda...theres my evidence. happy now?
No, you have to present what it is about that footage that shows it was fake.
Sorry, your arguments were debunked years ago. Do you have anything new?
http://www.clavius.org/techcrater.html (http://www.clavius.org/techcrater.html)
http://www.clavius.org/rover2.html (http://www.clavius.org/rover2.html)
http://www.clavius.org/trrnshdow.html (http://www.clavius.org/trrnshdow.html)
http://www.clavius.org/gravleap.html (http://www.clavius.org/gravleap.html)
And "walking oddly" is a rather vague claim. How specifically are they walking oddly, aside from moving awkwardly because they're in bulky suits?
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...show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
...the astronauts on the ISS travel through the South Atlantic Anomaly on a regular basis and survive.
well considering people believed everything they heard and saw on television back then its possible
Back then? What, a couple of hours ago when the ISS last went through the South Atlantic Anomaly?
;D
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OK here's my anomaly, the lack of tire tracks underneath the rover, no blast crater, astronauts walking oddly, the shadows, background, yadda yadda yadda...theres my evidence. happy now?
Here's a bit of friendly advice: we've heard it all before so you won't get anywhere posting the same old hoax claims that were debunked over ten years ago.
You're also not going to convince us that you're an intellectual with your laziness. Poor grammar, punctuation, capitalization, etc., and an unwillingness to defend your claims with evidence... why should we even bother with you? And why would you bother if you aren't going to give it your best effort? We're just going to chew you up and spit you out because you're an amateur. You might as well leave now and save yourself some embarrassment.
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im presenting my evidence is all
its actually harder for you to prove we actually went
theres more evidence proving it was fake then there is evidence proving it was real
oh we have moon rocks, and a crappy television shot....prove to me 100% it was real and ill eat my shoe...with ketchup lol
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can somebody say "front screen projection"?
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...nobody can prove the landings were real. unless you went there and looked at the stuff with your own eyes
If "you" had to be there to prove an event happened, then no detective could ever solve a crime, no archaeologist could ever conclude anything about the site they excavated. Heck, you're saying I can't even be sure that my team won the 2010 Australian Football Leage grand final.
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im presenting my evidence is all
its actually harder for you to prove we actually went
theres more evidence proving it was fake then there is evidence proving it was real
oh we have moon rocks, and a crappy television shot....prove to me 100% it was real and ill eat my show...with ketchup lol
Do you have any claims that aren't vague and haven't already been debunked? We're waiting.
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im presenting my evidence is all
You have presented no evidence whatsoever. All you have done is rattle off a few of the more common and easily debunked arguments, and demonstrated a total lack of understanding of radiation.
its actually harder for you to prove we actually went
We don't have to. That's not our burden of proof. You made the claim it was faked somehow. it is your responsibility to back that up.
theres more evidence proving it was fake then there is evidence proving it was real
I disagree. Show me the evidence it was fake.
oh we have moon rocks, and a crappy television shot
Oh we have far more than that, but if your research stops there that is, again, your issue, not ours.
prove to me 100% it was real
What would convince you?
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im presenting my evidence is all
its actually harder for you to prove we actually went
theres more evidence proving it was fake then there is evidence proving it was real
oh we have moon rocks, and a crappy television shot....prove to me 100% it was real and ill eat my show...with ketchup lol
Do you have any claims that aren't vague and haven't already been debunked? We're waiting.
ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
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can somebody say "front screen projection"?
Yes, and I can also say that categorically could not work to make the Apollo footage.
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can somebody say "front screen projection"?
Can somebody say "already debunked on this board"?
http://www.apollohoax.net/forum/index.php?topic=89.0 (http://www.apollohoax.net/forum/index.php?topic=89.0)
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im presenting my evidence is all
its actually harder for you to prove we actually went
theres more evidence proving it was fake then there is evidence proving it was real
oh we have moon rocks, and a crappy television shot....prove to me 100% it was real and ill eat my shoe...with ketchup lol
No you aren't, you have presented nothing.
No it isn't.
No there isn't. There is no "evidence" it was fake. There is mountains of evidence proving it was real.
It has been proven. You refuse to accept it. Bon appetit.
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ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Why don't you ask him why he won't come here to defend his claims?
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im presenting my evidence is all
But you forgot to check whether your claims had already been answered. They have. You're dredging up long-debunked beliefs.
its actually harder for you to prove we actually went
Is that why you're frantically trying to explain away the mountain of evidence that is accepted by all the relevant sciences as valid?
theres more evidence proving it was fake then there is evidence proving it was real
That's for you demonstrate. Bluster is not evidence.
oh we have moon rocks
Yes, explain how those have managed to fool every geologist for the past 40 years.
...and a crappy television shot.
Compared to what? How is its apparent quality relevant to its evidentiary value?
prove to me 100% it was real and ill eat my show...with ketchup lol
Attempting to shift the burden of proof is a form of admitting defeat. All the evidence in favor of Apollo's authenticity is that which you are frantically and unsuccessfully trying to explain away. You cannot.
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im presenting my evidence is all
You have presented no evidence whatsoever. All you have done is rattle off a few of the more common and easily debunked arguments, and demonstrated a total lack of understanding of radiation.
its actually harder for you to prove we actually went
We don't have to. That's not our burden of proof. You made the claim it was faked somehow. it is your responsibility to back that up.
theres more evidence proving it was fake then there is evidence proving it was real
I disagree. Show me the evidence it was fake.
oh we have moon rocks, and a crappy television shot
Oh we have far more than that, but if your research stops there that is, again, your issue, not ours.
prove to me 100% it was real
What would convince you?
all my evidence is online for public viewing. just take the time to look it up and investigate for yourself
hey if you can prove to me it was real i will believe it end of discussion
but proving it happened is far more harder then proving it was fake
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ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Done. And done again.
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im presenting my evidence is all
its actually harder for you to prove we actually went
theres more evidence proving it was fake then there is evidence proving it was real
oh we have moon rocks, and a crappy television shot....prove to me 100% it was real and ill eat my show...with ketchup lol
Do you have any claims that aren't vague and haven't already been debunked? We're waiting.
ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Ohhhh dear. I suspect now that you don't believe it was a hoax at all, or you don't care. You are a blatant troll. Sad.
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ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Jarrah tried to debate me, failed, and fled. And he knows it.
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I've never seen a single piece of evidence that suggests to someone with an understanding of the relevant fields that Apollo was hoaxed. Not one. I've been participating in these discussions for something like nine years now, and while I've seen one or two original claims in that time (not many), none of those could hold up under the slightest examination. If it is harder to "prove we went" than to prove a hoax, it is because a lot of the information proving the Apollo missions to be real actually requires understanding things, and the hoax garbage just requires regurgitating false claims.
And as my best friend puts it, yes, I understand what you're writing when you don't use proper English. However, I'm not proud of that. Why are you proud that you don't use proper English?
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ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Bwahahahahaha! Funny!
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all my evidence is online for public viewing. just take the time to look it up and investigate for yourself
hey if you can prove to me it was real i will believe it end of discussion
but proving it happened is far more harder then proving it was fake
We have looked at the "evidence". It is all based on scientific illiteracy, miscomprehension, and in some cases blatant lies.
You won't believe it because it has already been proven, and you refuse to believe.
It has been proven that it happened. There is no proof it was fake.
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all my evidence is online for public viewing. just take the time to look it up and investigate for yourself
I have. My web site is a response to it. You obviously haven't tried to expose yourself to ideas that differ from your own. One can hardly Google for "apollo hoax" without running across my site.
hey if you can prove to me it was real i will believe it end of discussion
Again shifting the burden of proof.
but proving it happened is far more harder then proving it was fake
Your "evidence" is not proof of fakery. It's proof only of the ignorance of hoax theories. "I don't understand what's happening there, therefore it must be a fake." That's an inference, not proof.
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all my evidence is online for public viewing.
No, your evidence is what you present here. I have seen all the Apollo footage. Your responsibility is to show what is wrong with it. 'Just go and look' is not evidence. You have already demonstrated a lack of understanding of a lot of technical stuff, so it's a good bet that what seems anomalous to you will not to us. There is no possible way to discuss it unless you tell us what it is you think is wrong with the footage.
just take the time to look it up and investigate for yourself
What makes you think I haven't? As I said, I have seen ALL the Apollo TV footage, and I've been doing this for over a decade now. How much have you seen?
hey if you can prove to me it was real i will believe it end of discussion
Provide us with a standard of proof to be met if you wish to challenge us to prove it was real. I could equally say that all my evidence it was real is online and you should go and research it yourself.
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ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Jarrah tried to debate me, failed, and fled. And he knows it.
wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
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Where's your evidence of faked Moon landings?
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Where's your evidence of faked Moon landings?
everywhere
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ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Jarrah tried to debate me, failed, and fled. And he knows it.
wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
http://tech.dir.groups.yahoo.com/group/apollo-hoax/message/224
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Where's your evidence of faked Moon landings?
everywhere
You are presumably just trolling now. Otherwise what is so hard for an intellectual to present a coherent argument rather than do everything he can to avoid actually discussing any technical aspect of it at all?
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ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Jarrah tried to debate me, failed, and fled. And he knows it.
wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
http://tech.dir.groups.yahoo.com/group/apollo-hoax/message/224
thats not proof lol
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wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
When you draw JW into the debate, everybody looks at you like this:
He doesn't know what he talks about, his claims are full of bad physics and deception. He routinely takes scientists, who disagree with him, as proof of his allegations. He can't even do basic arithmetic.
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wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
Wow, you really don't know anything about Jarrah White, do you?
IDDb.com, message board under Bart Sibrel's video "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon." I don't post there anymore, does someone have the exact link bookmarked?
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Where's your evidence of faked Moon landings?
everywhere
You are presumably just trolling now. Otherwise what is so hard for an intellectual to present a coherent argument rather than do everything he can to avoid actually discussing any technical aspect of it at all?
i dont have the time to present all the evidence considering its a big amount. youre not a retard im assuming, so go look it up for yourself its all for public domain
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thats not proof lol
Where's your evidence that Jarrah is "great" at anything other than hiding in his little hole at YouTube, emerging only occasionally to make a fool out of himself.
Explain why he was given the opportunity to present his findings to qualified academics in his hometown in Australia, but refused even to acknowledge the invitation.
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...oh we have moon rocks...
And how do you suppose we have moon rocks? I suspect I'm going to bore a few of the regulars now, but you deserve an individual answer. So here goes...
1. Are the "moon rocks" really Earth rocks tricked up in some NASA laboratory? No. Apollo rocks are different from Earth rocks in a number of fundamental ways. For one thing, the chemicals they consist of contain virtually no water, unlike equivalent rocks on Earth. For another, the Apollo rocks show evidence of having formed in a low gravity vacuum. That sort of feature is essentially impossible to fake.
2. Are the "moon rocks" really lunar meteorites? No. The distinctive feature of lunar meteorites is that their surfaces were melted by passing through the Earth's atmosphere at high speed. The distinctive feature of Apollo rocks is that their surfaces are pitted by microscopic craters caused by the impact of dust grains at speeds of tens of kilometres a second. We don't have the technology to accelerate dust grains to that speed, so those features must be natural.
3. Were the moon rocks collected by unmanned sample return missions? No. The Soviets managed to return 400 grams of material from the Moon in three missions - enough to fill a can of soup. The six Apollo missions returned about 380 kilograms of material - about 1000 times as much. This included soil, rocks and core samples up to 2.5 metres long. Much of this material was photographed prior to collection, and some of these photos include astronauts. If those photos were faked on a sound stage somewhere on Earth, how come the Apollo rocks show no sign of Earthly contamination? And if the photos were taken on the Moon, the only explanation for astronauts being in the photos is that the astronauts were on the Moon too.
...prove to me 100% it was real and ill eat my shoe...with ketchup lol
Nothing in life is 100%.
But the reality of Apollo has been demonstrated beyond all reasonable doubt.
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wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
Wow, you really don't know anything about Jarrah White, do you?
iwheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
Wow, you really don't know anything about Jarrah White, do you?
IDDb.com, message board under Bart Sibrel's video "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon." I don't post there anymore, does someone have the exact link bookmarked?
no i dont know him personally lol....tell me what you know about him
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http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0446557/board/nest/133905495?p=1
Edit: I've spent some hours the last few days reading this. My eyes still hurt.
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i dont have the time to present all the evidence considering its a big amount. youre not a retard im assuming, so go look it up for yourself its all for public domain
Do your own homework.
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no i dont know him personally lol....tell me what you know about him
Then you have no basis for claiming he's "great."
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i dont have the time to present all the evidence considering its a big amount.
In the time you've spent avoiding the issue you could have presented one coherent argument, even just focused on one single aspect. You haven't. Why? If you have drawn your conclusions surely you can present the argument easily?
youre not a retard im assuming, so go look it up for yourself its all for public domain
I give up. How many times do I have to tell you I HAVE looked it up, and I find nothing anomalous in the footage. YOU need to present specific examples. Even one would do as a start. Why do you find it so hard?
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...oh we have moon rocks...
And how do you suppose we have moon rocks? I suspect I'm going to bore a few of the regulars now, but you deserve an individual answer. So here goes...
1. Are the "moon rocks" really Earth rocks tricked up in some NASA laboratory? No. Apollo rocks are different from Earth rocks in a number of fundamental ways. For one thing, the chemicals they consist of contain virtually no water, unlike equivalent rocks on Earth. For another, the Apollo rocks show evidence of having formed in a low gravity vacuum. That sort of feature is essentially impossible to fake.
2. Are the "moon rocks" really lunar meteorites? No. The distinctive feature of lunar meteorites is that their surfaces were melted by passing through the Earth's atmosphere at high speed. The distinctive feature of Apollo rocks is that their surfaces are pitted by microscopic craters caused by the impact of dust grains at speeds of tens of kilometres a second. We don't have the technology to accelerate dust grains to that speed, so those features must be natural.
3. Were the moon rocks collected by unmanned sample return missions? No. The Soviets managed to return 400 grams of material from the Moon in three missions - enough to fill a can of soup. The six Apollo missions returned about 380 kilograms of material - about 1000 times as much. This included soil, rocks and core samples up to 2.5 metres long. Much of this material was photographed prior to collection, and some of these photos include astronauts. If those photos were faked on a sound stage somewhere on Earth, how come the Apollo rocks show no sign of Earthly contamination? And if the photos were taken on the Moon, the only explanation for astronauts being in the photos is that the astronauts were on the Moon too.
...prove to me 100% it was real and ill eat my shoe...with ketchup lol
Nothing in life is 100%.
But the reality of Apollo has been demonstrated beyond all reasonable doubt.
ok, then explain to me why japan (i think) was the ones who sent a probe to the moon and took lunar samples and said the lunar samples they took were completely different then of what apollo took....explain that apollogists lol
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Where's your evidence of faked Moon landings?
everywhere
You are presumably just trolling now. Otherwise what is so hard for an intellectual to present a coherent argument rather than do everything he can to avoid actually discussing any technical aspect of it at all?
i dont have the time to present all the evidence considering its a big amount. youre not a retard im assuming, so go look it up for yourself its all for public domain
There is no such evidence. Sitting there saying, "it's out there somewhere" is lazy and intellectually dishonest.
PLEASE use proper spelling and grammar, your current posting style makes it very hard to read what you write.
May I ask, why did you come here? You are refusing to talk about what you believe and why... so why join a message board if you won't "message"?
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i dont have the time to present all the evidence considering its a big amount.
In the time you've spent avoiding the issue you could have presented one coherent argument, even just focused on one single aspect. You haven't. Why? If you have drawn your conclusions surely you can present the argument easily?
youre not a retard im assuming, so go look it up for yourself its all for public domain
I give up. How many times do I have to tell you I HAVE looked it up, and I find nothing anomalous in the footage. YOU need to present specific examples. Even one would do as a start. Why do you find it so hard?
http://images.search.yahoo.com/images/view;_ylt=A0PDoS142mpR5HgAJRiJzbkF;_ylu=X3oDMTBlMTQ4cGxyBHNlYwNzcgRzbGsDaW1n?back=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.search.yahoo.com%2Fsearch%2Fimages%3Fp%3Dapollo%2Brover%2Bno%2Btracks%26fr%3Dyfp-t-900%26fr2%3Dpiv-web%26tab%3Dorganic%26ri%3D4&w=2340&h=2364&imgurl=apolloanomalies.com%2Fimages%2FALSJ%2FAS17-137-20979HR.jpg&rurl=http%3A%2F%2Fapolloanomalies.com%2Frover_tracks_rebuttal.htm&size=1.1+KB&name=ApolloAnomaLies.com+-+Rebuttal+of+Windley%26%2339%3Bs+Photo+%26quot%3BAnalysis%26quot%3B&p=apollo+rover+no+tracks&oid=fe51644abaab223ab056fb6697e9fbf8&fr2=piv-web&fr=yfp-t-900&tt=ApolloAnomaLies.com%2B-%2BRebuttal%2Bof%2BWindley%2526%252339%253Bs%2BPhoto%2B%2526quot%253BAnalysis%2526quot%253B&b=0&ni=21&no=4&ts=&tab=organic&sigr=11k0qj01j&sigb=13fcgdpi4&sigi=11kdcdu4q&.crumb=qVdazOyrlxa
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ok, then explain to me why japan (i think) was the ones who sent a probe to the moon and took lunar samples and said the lunar samples they took were completely different then of what apollo took....explain that apollogists lol
Provide the source for that claim first.
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ok, then explain to me why japan (i think) was the ones who sent a probe to the moon and took lunar samples and said the lunar samples they took were completely different then of what apollo took....explain that apollogists lol
Why are we on the hook to explain something you only merely "think" you recall.
Hint: the country was the Soviet Union, and they didn't reach the conclusion you say they did. Try again.
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Where's your evidence of faked Moon landings?
everywhere
Ok, since you aren't doing anything to prove your claims you are in danger of being banned for trolling.
If you don't start providing evidence for you claims I will ban you. Is that clear enough? Just repeating the same false claims that you read on other websites or saw in a Jarrah White video, isn't good enough.
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ok, then explain to me why japan (i think) was the ones who sent a probe to the moon and took lunar samples and said the lunar samples they took were completely different then of what apollo took....explain that apollogists lol
Cite?
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ok, then explain to me why japan (i think) was the ones who sent a probe to the moon and took lunar samples and said the lunar samples they took were completely different then of what apollo took....explain that apollogists lol
Why don't you provide the evidence to support your claims?
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http://images.search.yahoo.com/images/view;_ylt=A0PDoS142mpR5HgAJRiJzbkF;_ylu=X3oDMTBlMTQ4cGxyBHNlYwNzcgRzbGsDaW1n?back=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.search.yahoo.com%2Fsearch%2Fimages%3Fp%3Dapollo%2Brover%2Bno%2Btracks%26fr%3Dyfp-t-900%26fr2%3Dpiv-web%26tab%3Dorganic%26ri%3D4&w=2340&h=2364&imgurl=apolloanomalies.com%2Fimages%2FALSJ%2FAS17-137-20979HR.jpg&rurl=http%3A%2F%2Fapolloanomalies.com%2Frover_tracks_rebuttal.htm&size=1.1+KB&name=ApolloAnomaLies.com+-+Rebuttal+of+Windley%26%2339%3Bs+Photo+%26quot%3BAnalysis%26quot%3B&p=apollo+rover+no+tracks&oid=fe51644abaab223ab056fb6697e9fbf8&fr2=piv-web&fr=yfp-t-900&tt=ApolloAnomaLies.com%2B-%2BRebuttal%2Bof%2BWindley%2526%252339%253Bs%2BPhoto%2B%2526quot%253BAnalysis%2526quot%253B&b=0&ni=21&no=4&ts=&tab=organic&sigr=11k0qj01j&sigb=13fcgdpi4&sigi=11kdcdu4q&.crumb=qVdazOyrlxa
Covered on my website, which you obviously have no intention of reading.
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ok, then explain to me why japan (i think) was the ones who sent a probe to the moon and took lunar samples and said the lunar samples they took were completely different then of what apollo took....explain that apollogists lol
Why don't you provide the evidence to support your claims?
again, i am not on trial. we have a thing called the internet, go type it in the search box and press enter lol
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again, i am not on trial.
Yes, you are. Your claims are, anyway. Gesturing vaguely to the Internet and saying it proves your point is not a suitable argument.
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http://images.search.yahoo.com/images/view;_ylt=A0PDoS142mpR5HgAJRiJzbkF;_ylu=X3oDMTBlMTQ4cGxyBHNlYwNzcgRzbGsDaW1n?back=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.search.yahoo.com%2Fsearch%2Fimages%3Fp%3Dapollo%2Brover%2Bno%2Btracks%26fr%3Dyfp-t-900%26fr2%3Dpiv-web%26tab%3Dorganic%26ri%3D4&w=2340&h=2364&imgurl=apolloanomalies.com%2Fimages%2FALSJ%2FAS17-137-20979HR.jpg&rurl=http%3A%2F%2Fapolloanomalies.com%2Frover_tracks_rebuttal.htm&size=1.1+KB&name=ApolloAnomaLies.com+-+Rebuttal+of+Windley%26%2339%3Bs+Photo+%26quot%3BAnalysis%26quot%3B&p=apollo+rover+no+tracks&oid=fe51644abaab223ab056fb6697e9fbf8&fr2=piv-web&fr=yfp-t-900&tt=ApolloAnomaLies.com%2B-%2BRebuttal%2Bof%2BWindley%2526%252339%253Bs%2BPhoto%2B%2526quot%253BAnalysis%2526quot%253B&b=0&ni=21&no=4&ts=&tab=organic&sigr=11k0qj01j&sigb=13fcgdpi4&sigi=11kdcdu4q&.crumb=qVdazOyrlxa
Covered on my website, which you obviously have no intention of reading.
i am open to all evidence. im not hard set on believing it was fake. i would just like to see some real evidence is all...whats wrong with that?
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It's all out in the public domain. Search for it. You're on the internet.
;)
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i am open to all evidence. im not hard set on believing it was fake. i would just like to see some real evidence is all...whats wrong with that?
Rubbish. Go and read jay's site if you're so open to all the evidence. We'll wait for you.
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Apollo_deception, actually, evidence from Japan's lunar probe SELENE supports Apollo. Don't tell us to do research if you're not willing to do any yourself.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third-party_evidence_for_Apollo_Moon_landings#SELENE_photographs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third-party_evidence_for_Apollo_Moon_landings#SELENE_photographs)
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believe me. i want to believe it was all real. i dont want to think it was all filmed on a stage set somewhere. i love my country and want to trust those higher up......
i guess someday we will know the truth
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ok, then explain to me why japan (i think) was the ones who sent a probe to the moon and took lunar samples and said the lunar samples they took were completely different then of what apollo took....explain that apollogists lol
Why don't you provide the evidence to support your claims?
again, i am not on trial. we have a thing called the internet, go type it in the search box and press enter lol
Oh i have everything I need right here thanks, I just don't believe you know what you're talking about and are pretty much making stuff up. Feel free to prove me wrong.
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i am open to all evidence.
Then go away, read my web site, and come back when you understand it. You're bringing up questions that were answered more than a decade ago.
im not hard set on believing it was fake. i would just like to see some real evidence is all...whats wrong with that?
What do you think you're frantically trying to explain away?
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i am open to all evidence. im not hard set on believing it was fake.
The name "Apollo_deception" doesn't exactly imply an open mind. ::)
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believe me. i want to believe it was all real. i dont want to think it was all filmed on a stage set somewhere. i love my country and want to trust those higher up......
i guess someday we will know the truth
Then stop believing the word of some idiot Australian and start checking facts for yourself.
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believe me. i want to believe it was all real. i dont want to think it was all filmed on a stage set somewhere. i love my country and want to trust those higher up......
i guess someday we will know the truth
Nice backpedal, but every hoax believer says he wants to be convinced it wasn't a hoax. Then he proceeds to dig in with both heels and argue the flimsiest evidence. You've simply gone down the standard list of claims written up by the ignorant to fool the gullible.
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Apollo_deception, actually, evidence from Japan's lunar probe SELENE supports Apollo. Don't tell us to do research if you're not willing to do any yourself.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third-party_evidence_for_Apollo_Moon_landings#SELENE_photographs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third-party_evidence_for_Apollo_Moon_landings#SELENE_photographs)
ya like some pixelled out image is proof?
i need to see a better resolution image of the decent stages to really start believing it
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The Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter has already taken those images. You're either unfamiliar with them or you've already brushed them off as a hoax.
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believe me. i want to believe it was all real. i dont want to think it was all filmed on a stage set somewhere. i love my country and want to trust those higher up......
i guess someday we will know the truth
Nice backpedal, but every hoax believer says he wants to be convinced it wasn't a hoax. Then he proceeds to dig in with both heels and argue the flimsiest evidence. You've simply gone down the standard list of claims written up by the ignorant to fool the gullible.
no backpedaling, like ive said in my past posts. i am open to all evidence. i want to believe....UNDERSTAND THAT!
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believe me. i want to believe it was all real. i dont want to think it was all filmed on a stage set somewhere. i love my country and want to trust those higher up......
i guess someday we will know the truth
As I see it, you don't know the truth and you are willfully keeping the truth away from yourself. It is intellectually dishonest to claim something was faked, not support that point of view, disregard highly competent professionals who disagree, and NOT adjust one's views accordingly.
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ya like some pixelled out image is proof?
i need to see a better resolution image of the decent stages to really start believing it
So much for being "open to all evidence."
Exactly what evidence would change your mind? Be specific.
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Who else is filling out a bingo card?
Fred
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The Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter has already taken those images. You're either unfamiliar with them or you've already brushed them off as a hoax.
I HAVE LOOKED AT ALL LRO IMAGES
IM SORRY, BUT PIXELS DONT CONVINCE ME LOL
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no backpedaling, like ive said in my past posts. i am open to all evidence. i want to believe....UNDERSTAND THAT!
I don't believe you. You're well versed in the conspiracy claims, but you have almost complete ignorance of the long-standing replies to them. One-sided research does not convey the impression of objectivity.
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Please stop shouting.
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...the master Jarrah White lol?
The what? Is he anything like the bloke on the left?
(http://lacithedog.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/ecky-thump.jpg)
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The Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter has already taken those images. You're either unfamiliar with them or you've already brushed them off as a hoax.
I HAVE LOOKED AT ALL LRO IMAGES
IM SORRY, BUT PIXELS DONT CONVINCE ME LOL
Definitely a troll.
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Could someone put this troll and accompanying thread out of it's misery?
unsuccessful troll is unsuccessful.
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ya like some pixelled out image is proof?
i need to see a better resolution image of the decent stages to really start believing it
So much for being "open to all evidence."
Exactly what evidence would change your mind? Be specific.
I AM OPEN TO ALL EVICENCE. THATS WHY I LOOKED OVER ALL IMAGES WITH A FINE TOOTH COMB. AND THE LRO IMAGES ARENT ENOUGH PROOF
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Stop shouting.
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The Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter has already taken those images. You're either unfamiliar with them or you've already brushed them off as a hoax.
I HAVE LOOKED AT ALL LRO IMAGES
IM SORRY, BUT PIXELS DONT CONVINCE ME LOL
Definitely a troll.
YOU PEOPLE ON HERE GET SO ANGRY WITH THIS SUBJECT....TAKE A XANAX FOR CRYING OUT LOUD LOL
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Is your caps lock key stuck or are you being deliberately obnoxious?
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Stop shouting.
sorry all caps was on my bad lol
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ok, then explain to me why japan (i think) was the ones who sent a probe to the moon and took lunar samples and said the lunar samples they took were completely different then of what apollo took....explain that apollogists lol
Neither Hiten or SELENE took samples from the Moon, so I have no idea what you're talking about. Why don't you sort out which mission it was and get back to us.
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Your CAPS LOCK is stuck. Please don't use all caps, it is annoying to read, and gives the impression you're shouting. And the first to raise his voice in an argument, has by defintion lost, because volume doesn't negate right.
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The Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter has already taken those images. You're either unfamiliar with them or you've already brushed them off as a hoax.
I HAVE LOOKED AT ALL LRO IMAGES
IM SORRY, BUT PIXELS DONT CONVINCE ME LOL
Definitely a troll.
YOU PEOPLE ON HERE GET SO ANGRY WITH THIS SUBJECT....TAKE A XANAX FOR CRYING OUT LOUD LOL
I don't know about anyone else, but having the hard work and amazing achievements of so many people dismissed by someone as lies does annoy me.
Also, Xanax is used to treat anxiety and panic disorders, not anger. If you are going to suggest drugs for us to take, at least pick the right ones.
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Who else is filling out a bingo card?
I am now that I've found mine.
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The Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter has already taken those images. You're either unfamiliar with them or you've already brushed them off as a hoax.
I HAVE LOOKED AT ALL LRO IMAGES
IM SORRY, BUT PIXELS DONT CONVINCE ME LOL
Definitely a troll.
YOU PEOPLE ON HERE GET SO ANGRY WITH THIS SUBJECT....TAKE A XANAX FOR CRYING OUT LOUD LOL
I don't know about anyone else, but having the hard work and amazing achievements of so many people dismissed by someone as lies does annoy me.
Also, Xanax is used to treat anxiety and panic disorders, not anger. If you are going to suggest drugs for us to take, at least pick the right ones.
yes warden. sorry warden lol
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YOU PEOPLE ON HERE GET SO ANGRY WITH THIS SUBJECT....TAKE A XANAX FOR CRYING OUT LOUD LOL
You're very ignorant about this subject, and a poor debater. Don't redirect your anger at us.
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im just typing. you can read without punctuation right?
So you are saying, it is more important that YOU save a couple of seconds, than that twenty or more people reading your posts spend a few extra seconds puzzling them out.
There is no polite way of putting this. This is selfish, pure and simple.
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Still waiting for some actual evidence of a hoax to be presented here...
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The Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter has already taken those images. You're either unfamiliar with them or you've already brushed them off as a hoax.
I HAVE LOOKED AT ALL LRO IMAGES
IM SORRY, BUT PIXELS DONT CONVINCE ME LOL
Definitely a troll.
YOU PEOPLE ON HERE GET SO ANGRY WITH THIS SUBJECT....TAKE A XANAX FOR CRYING OUT LOUD LOL
I don't know about anyone else, but having the hard work and amazing achievements of so many people dismissed by someone as lies does annoy me.
Also, Xanax is used to treat anxiety and panic disorders, not anger. If you are going to suggest drugs for us to take, at least pick the right ones.
yes warden. sorry warden lol
Sarcasm doesn't become you.
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Who else is filling out a bingo card?
I am now that I've found mine.
The only question is whether this will end in a ban or a flounce.
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yes warden. sorry warden lol
If you want to converse, converse. Stop with the sarcasm and trolling.
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
Quit the name calling.
I am not going to abandon my critical thinking skills and my years of education and experience based on someone screaming at me "It was fake because I say so! Wah!"
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
I'll add my voice to a couple of the others. Go to Jay's Clavius website and read it through. Then come back to us.
Cheers
Peter B
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
So are we all brainwashed apologists, or are you desperately hoping to get evidence that makes you believe Apollo was real? Make up your mind, please.
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
Not with the pseudo-arguments you've presented. You display colossal ignorance of the relevant scientific and engineering fields. You throw tantrums. When asked for evidence, you simply point to the internet vaguely and say it's out there. When relevant rebuttals are brought to your attention you ignore them.
Yeah, you're not going to get through to anyone like that.
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
Not if you refuse to provide anything of substance, no.
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You know, even if I'm having "just a conversation" with some friends, if one of them makes a ridiculous and inaccurate claim, I will ask that person to provide specifics to show that they have even the vaguest idea what they're talking about. No matter what the subject is.
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Conversation? (Notice we left the term "debate" behind a long time ago, and even "discussion" is walking off, shaking its head).
This is more like listening to an extremely drunk person attempting a rant:
"And anutha thing! I said, an anutha thing..."
"What thing?"
"...What thing what?"
"You were saying there was another thing."
"...Yeah! Iz was anutha thing! And they were too!"
"Who was?"
"All of them!"
Most boring hoaxie ever. And I visit Godlike Productions on a regular basis.
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Most boring hoaxie ever. And I visit Godlike Productions on a regular basis.
I'm sorry.
Still, this is livening up my Sunday morning, so that's something.
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no backpedaling, like ive said in my past posts. i am open to all evidence. i want to believe....UNDERSTAND THAT!
No you are not and no you don't. Quite simply put you are lying. You have made your mind up about what you believe long before you posted on here.
You have chosen to believe the likes of that extremely arrogant idiot Jarrah White, and no matter what anyone says here you will never believe otherwise, so really why do you bother posting here?
I think its because you get your kicks from being the way you have shown yourself to be in your posts.
Remember in this forum you have to attempt to PROVE, with EVIDENCE (that you provide and not just say "its out there go look for it!) with relevant Calculations and number crunching! its up to YOU to prove it was fake not US to prove it was real.
You cannot do any of the above though can you?
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Also, stop 'lol'ing. You come across as a drooling baby when you do that.
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Also, stop 'lol'ing. You come across as a drooling baby when you do that.
I find that an insult to my 6 month old baby girl as she does indeed drool but has never 'lol'ed ....although to be fair she has gurgled and giggled out loud a few times ;)
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with the virtually endless budget NASA had it is possible for them to fake it
i mean come on, its the government for christs sake lol
virtually endless? That's hilarious! You've never actually looked at the budget and what it was used for have you?=
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts....show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
Prove any of your statement. I'll bet you can't. I'm betting you are just regurgitating something you read on a badly written hoax site. By the way, did you know they went AROUND the majority of the belts?
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they just recently found a 3rd belt of radiation that exists
i dont see how aluminum can shield radiation?
Paper can shield you from some radiation.
Of course the Apollo spaceraft weren't JUST aluminum but I'll bet you didn't know that. They don't usually mention it on the sites you're regurgitating.
its said you need at least 2 feet of lead for protection.
By whom? Please give a source. You'd be the first.
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no I'm a skeptic. i don't know for sure what happened. and quite frankly i don't think anyone in this forum knows for sure exactly what happened on July 20Th 1969
all i know is a lot of stuff doesn't add up
that we all can agree on, correct?
No.
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im presenting my evidence is all
its actually harder for you to prove we actually went
theres more evidence proving it was fake then there is evidence proving it was real
oh we have moon rocks, and a crappy television shot....prove to me 100% it was real and ill eat my show...with ketchup lol
Do you have any claims that aren't vague and haven't already been debunked? We're waiting.
ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Jarrah White is a blowhard who debunks himself. He proves time and time again that he is as ignorant of the relevant concepts as you appear to be. If he can't Google an answer then to him it doesn't exist.
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ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Jarrah tried to debate me, failed, and fled. And he knows it.
wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
There were witnesses. I and many others watched it happen. Jarrah tried to Google his way through a complex subject, failed multiple times, resorted to profanity and got himself banned from IMDB. Then he lied about it later.
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ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Jarrah tried to debate me, failed, and fled. And he knows it.
wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
http://tech.dir.groups.yahoo.com/group/apollo-hoax/message/224
thats not proof lol
I don't know about that. You just proved you didn't read it.
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ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Jarrah tried to debate me, failed, and fled. And he knows it.
wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
http://tech.dir.groups.yahoo.com/group/apollo-hoax/message/224
thats not proof lol
I don't know about that. You just proved you didn't read it.
I just started to read that. And already in his first 'point' he proves his ignorance. I've been an amateur photographer for 30 years or more, and what he writes about gloves and adjusting settings on the camera makes no sense. >>>The local gravity does not interact with the stops on the settings - these are spring-loaded<<<
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It is to laugh. 12 spammy hoaxer pages in a day, and I missed it all. LO, I shall say no more for fear of moddy wrath
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look at all the footage theres my evidence i should have to present the evidence its all for public viewing online
You mean the footage that shows a 1/6 g vacuum environment in very long continuous shots that no one has figured out a possible way to fake as all the mechanisms proposed by "Apollo sceptics" have fatal flaws if you go outside the specific piece of footage they were made up to explain?
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look at all the footage theres my evidence i should have to present the evidence its all for public viewing online
You mean the footage that shows a 1/6 g vacuum environment in very long continuous shots that no one has figured out a possible way to fake as all the mechanisms proposed by "Apollo sceptics" have fatal flaws if you go outside the specific piece of footage they were made up to explain?
No, he doesn't think it "looks right" without explaining how exactly he knows what might "look right". Dunning Kruger.
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Can we quit with the Dunning Kruger diagnoses? Like accusations of trolling, it is my opinion that it doesn't really further the conversation.
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Can we quit with the Dunning Kruger diagnoses? Like accusations of trolling, it is my opinion that it doesn't really further the conversation.
I by and large agree, but there comes a point where one is forced to realise that there is no conversation to be had. And what shall we do at that point? Curl up and die? Or at least make an attempt to determine why an individual will cling to whatever is their conspiracy poison? After a point, we all know that a crackpot is at hand. Should we indulge them as you propose? No.
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Feh. I don't think DK is appropriate or necessary for YouTube grade posters. They don't have an inflated opinion of their own skills...they just have an inflated opinion on the worth of their opinion.
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I by and large agree, but there comes a point where one is forced to realise that there is no conversation to be had. And what shall we do at that point? Curl up and die? Or at least make an attempt to determine why an individual will cling to whatever is their conspiracy poison? After a point, we all know that a crackpot is at hand. Should we indulge them as you propose? No.
My problem it has feels like it has become part of the forum language of insult rather than an actual useful statment.
Every community forms its own little lingo, and this seems to be one of them.
It is my opinion that the truth needs no insults to support itself, and therefore we should do our very best to avoid them.
Should we indulge this one?
No, but I hope we can maintain professionalism and courtesy, even when it is not returned.
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The most irritating thing is ending every post with lol. I hate that.
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The most irritating thing is ending every post with lol. I hate that.
If he didn't do it, he might have time to punctuate properly...
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no trap, im just a curious, intellectual person who is trying to get to the bottom of this anomaly we call "Apollo"
So why did you create a poll? Do you think the truth depends on a majority vote?
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wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
"master"
(http://i627.photobucket.com/albums/tt353/jarvisn/969594-queenlaugh_zps7e676487.jpg)
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So why did you create a poll? Do you think the truth depends on a majority vote?
Ha--and if it does, what does it prove that no poll shows a majority of any population believes in the hoax?
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all my evidence is online for public viewing. just take the time to look it up and investigate for yourself
hey if you can prove to me it was real i will believe it end of discussion
but proving it happened is far more harder then proving it was fake
Despite the long time since this post, i'll give my answer as well. The evidence is not really the issue. It is the interpretation of the evidence. Hoax believers most grandly fail because they do not differentiate between the evidence they look at and their own interpretation. So unless you bring it to use, we cannot know what you think supports your claim and why. It is impossible to have a conversation with somebody who only says, "It's all around, just look," without telling us what he is looking at.
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So we have a poll with three incompatible options, and you're allowed to choose two?
It's a board about whether the moon landings were faked. DK or not, how elevated does anyone expect the conversation to be?
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wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
Jarrah White... the Master..... hahahaha!! ILSHIAFOMC!!!
Jarrah White is the master of NOTHING. He simply regurgitates what he reads on the internet, and cannot keep up with a real debate with people like Jay, who tend to ask questions that cannot easily be Googled.
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And "walking oddly" is a rather vague claim. How specifically are they walking oddly, aside from moving awkwardly because they're in bulky suits?
...and in 1/6 gravity...
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What is with this flood of lazy concern trolls? All of them seem to want to have a discussion about the discussion. I'm assuming because it is too much work to bring up anything of substance.
Makes me more kindly towards the rover business.
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Why don't you ask him why he won't come here to defend his claims?
Actually, Jarrah's here all the time. Perhaps he's just a bit shy.
::)
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I'm not sure why you guys are putting any energy into engaging this one. He's either a troll, or has an intellect on par with an eggplant. (maybe both)
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
The big wide world is awaiting your ground breaking proof. Why bother on an internet forum when you can knock the scientific world off its feet?
Where are you going to start first?
Serious question really.
lol
(edit don't think I have used lol before, thought I would try it out seeing as it is getting around a lot)
(edit con't, still does not feel right.....)
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I was wondering if perhaps we havent formulated our questions in a manner which gently allows apollo_deception to makes their case.
may I lead the query with the following question?
apollo_deception, based on the evidence of the greek probe sent to the lunar surface in 1973, how do you correlate the bacterial findings it provided with those discovered by the Skylab 4 mission which landed only 6 months earlier?
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I'm not sure why you guys are putting any energy into engaging this one. He's either a troll, or has an intellect on par with an eggplant. (maybe both)
Because that is what we do.
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I was wondering if perhaps we havent formulated our questions in a manner which gently allows apollo_deception to makes their case.
may I lead the query with the following question?
apollo_deception, based on the evidence of the greek probe sent to the lunar surface in 1973, how do you correlate the bacterial findings it provided with those discovered by the Skylab 4 mission which landed only 6 months earlier?
In all my reading about space travel, that is something I've never seen properly addressed. I'd like to know the answer, too.
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I was wondering if perhaps we havent formulated our questions in a manner which gently allows apollo_deception to makes their case.
may I lead the query with the following question?
apollo_deception, based on the evidence of the greek probe sent to the lunar surface in 1973, how do you correlate the bacterial findings it provided with those discovered by the Skylab 4 mission which landed only 6 months earlier?
In all my reading about space travel, that is something I've never seen properly addressed. I'd like to know the answer, too.
I'm also extremely interested in this too. I've never seen anyone giving what I would define as real, compelling evidence.
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apollo_deception, based on the evidence of the greek probe sent to the lunar surface in 1973, how do you correlate the bacterial findings it provided with those discovered by the Skylab 4 mission which landed only 6 months earlier?
The termination of this very promising programme was one of the unfortunate consequences of the collapse of the Ioannidis regime in 1974.
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts....show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
Ah, yes. "Show me one person who went through them - except for the people who went through them. Once I discount them as liars, then there's no one who went through them. QED."
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
Quit the name calling.
Well, he just called you Lil, which isn't too bad. ;)
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actually no amount of money will get you through the deadly Van Allen Belts....show me one person who has went through it besides apollo?
The crews of Gemini 10 and 11 entered the Van Allen belts on their flights. The astronauts on the ISS travel through the South Atlantic Anomaly on a regular basis and survive. Were you aware of this, or are you saying those flights were/are faked too?
And the Space Shuttle has passed through it (SAA) numerous times.
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
Quit the name calling.
Well, he just called you Lil, which isn't too bad. ;)
But everyone knew her as Nancy.
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apollo_deception, based on the evidence of the greek probe sent to the lunar surface in 1973, how do you correlate the bacterial findings it provided with those discovered by the Skylab 4 mission which landed only 6 months earlier?
The termination of this very promising programme was one of the unfortunate consequences of the collapse of the Ioannidis regime in 1974.
Ah and that would explain the beginnings of the current fiscal problems which beset the Greek nation. Apollo-deception would you agree on this hypothesis?
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apollo_deception, based on the evidence of the greek probe sent to the lunar surface in 1973, how do you correlate the bacterial findings it provided with those discovered by the Skylab 4 mission which landed only 6 months earlier?
The termination of this very promising programme was one of the unfortunate consequences of the collapse of the Ioannidis regime in 1974.
Wales has never recovered from it.
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
Quit the name calling.
Well, he just called you Lil, which isn't too bad. ;)
But everyone knew her as Nancy.
Ooooh, Rocky Racoooooon!
White Album oddness, certainly.
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ask Jarrah White. I bet you cant debunk him lol
Jarrah tried to debate me, failed, and fled. And he knows it.
wheres your evidence to prove this claim that you successfully debunked the master Jarrah White lol?
If JW hasn't been successfully debunked, then why does he fear coming to this board, and telling us all how wrong we are?
The answer is obvious...JW knows that he would be compelled to obey the rules, here...to provide ACTUAL EVIDENCE that the landings were faked, and he knows he can't do that.
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
Quit the name calling.
Well, he just called you Lil, which isn't too bad. ;)
But everyone knew her as Nancy.
Didn't she used to work at St. Alfonzo's Pancake Breakfast?
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But everyone knew her as Nancy.
As long as he doesn't call us Shirley...
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But everyone knew her as Nancy.
As long as he doesn't call us Shirley...
Whats our vector, Victor?
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
Quit the name calling.
Well, he just called you Lil, which isn't too bad. ;)
But everyone knew her as Nancy.
Didn't she used to work at St. Alfonzo's Pancake Breakfast?
She stole the margarine.
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
Quit the name calling.
Well, he just called you Lil, which isn't too bad. ;)
But everyone knew her as Nancy.
Didn't she used to work at St. Alfonzo's Pancake Breakfast?
I don't know about that, but here is a video clip of Zappa on the Steve Allan Show in 1963 playing improvisational music two bicycles. Never let it be said that he wasn't innovative.
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theres no getting through to you apologists is there Lil
Quit the name calling.
Well, he just called you Lil, which isn't too bad. ;)
But everyone knew her as Nancy.
She's no fun, she fell right over.
Wait, didn't I say that on the other side of the album?
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I'm not sure why you guys are putting any energy into engaging this one. He's either a troll, or has an intellect on par with an eggplant. (maybe both)
Because that is what we do.
I think it's more prudent to pick your battles. Attention-seekers are only interested in winding people up to elicit responses. Pretending to have some particular dog in the fight is just a ploy to achieve their objective.
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I'm not sure why you guys are putting any energy into engaging this one. He's either a troll, or has an intellect on par with an eggplant. (maybe both)
Because that is what we do.
I think it's more prudent to pick your battles. Attention-seekers are only interested in winding people up to elicit responses. Pretending to have some particular dog in the fight is just a ploy to achieve their objective.
Nevertheless, we need to give each hox beleiver who comes here a long rope with wich to hang himself. If that means we have to do a bit of work to learn about Apollo in order to debunk him, then so much the better. We typically do not leave a HB's claims unchallenged. But you are right that there is a point of diminishing returns when the HB is either repetitive, rude or unresponsive to criticism that eventually lead to a ban. Until LO makes such a determination to ban or he quits, he will get a response.
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She's no fun, she fell right over.
Wait, didn't I say that on the other side of the album?
All Hail МДЯЖ and LЄИИФИ.
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...the master Jarrah White lol?
The what? Is he anything like the bloke on the left?
(http://lacithedog.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/ecky-thump.jpg)
Technically, the guy on the left is a Grand Master of Ecky Thump... ;D
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That show should be pulled, the cruelty to black puddings was terrible.
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Ahhh, the Goodies. I first discovered them in the summer of 1980, and my life hasn't been the same since.
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Ahhh, the Goodies. I first discovered them in the summer of 1980, and my life hasn't been the same since.
They achieved close to cult status in Australia given how frequently they were repeated on ABC TV in the late 1970s and early 1980s. Apparently the shows got little replay in the UK, meaning the Goodies had a higher status in Oz than the UK.
I went to a live show they did on a tour of Australia about 8 years ago. Just as funny.
The thing I realise now about their humour was how edgy a lot of it was, even with the slapstick mixed in, along with how well a lot of it has aged.
ETA: I just noticed the result of the poll. Even without my vote I think the result is fairly definitive.
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They ran on public television in South Carolina in the summer of '80, and that's how I got hooked. I only saw six or eight episodes, and despaired of ever seeing any more until a few years ago when they became available online. I jumped on them like a starving wolf on a rabbit.
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Whenever I think of The Goodies, the image that comes into my mind is Kitten Kong, climbing (and knocking over) the Post Office Tower in London. Also, the Roots parody, Hoots, about a Scots ancestor of one of the team. The location was described as being on the shores of Loch Jaw, in the shadow of Ben Doon, between Glen Ford and Glen Campbell... those programmes had me in stitches!
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"It's gold ore."
"Gold ore?"
"Or something else..."
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ETA: I just noticed the result of the poll. Even without my vote I think the result is fairly definitive.
Are you kidding? I didn't even realize we had that many active members!
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Ahhh, the Goodies. I first discovered them in the summer of 1980, and my life hasn't been the same since.
They achieved close to cult status in Australia given how frequently they were repeated on ABC TV in the late 1970s and early 1980s. Apparently the shows got little replay in the UK, meaning the Goodies had a higher status in Oz than the UK.
I went to a live show they did on a tour of Australia about 8 years ago. Just as funny.
The thing I realise now about their humour was how edgy a lot of it was, even with the slapstick mixed in, along with how well a lot of it has aged.
ETA: I just noticed the result of the poll. Even without my vote I think the result is fairly definitive.
Didn't vote either, but the lone nut theory strikes again.
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I am too late to vote.
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I skipped the voting because I figured that no matter the results, the OP would use the poll for his own purposes. I too am surprised there were that many users.
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ok, then explain to me why japan (i think) was the ones who sent a probe to the moon and took lunar samples and said the lunar samples they took were completely different then of what apollo took....explain that apollogists lol
Neither Hiten or SELENE took samples from the Moon, so I have no idea what you're talking about. Why don't you sort out which mission it was and get back to us.
This seemed to slip past.
I wonder where he got the info about samples from Hiten and Selene.
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Same place the hoax'ers get all their information. They make it themselves.
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All Hail МДЯЖ and LЄИИФИ.
???
Who are Mdyazh and Leiifi?
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ok, then explain to me why japan (i think) was the ones who sent a probe to the moon and took lunar samples and said the lunar samples they took were completely different then of what apollo took....explain that apollogists lol
Neither Hiten or SELENE took samples from the Moon, so I have no idea what you're talking about. Why don't you sort out which mission it was and get back to us.
This seemed to slip past.
I wonder where he got the info about samples from Hiten and Selene.
Just one of many things that Apollo Deception, like every one of the shrinking number of devoted Apollo deniers, either made up or lied about, or refused to either answer or address.
It is perhaps more notable that despite the thread topic (which was of his choosing) he never went anywhere near nominating ANY Apollo image he thought might be faked, let alone the best example in his opinion.
It illustrates why the numbers of Apollo hoax believers has dwindled to almost nothing - those who have reasoning skills have listened and observed and learnt. Those like Apollo Deception will never be reasoned out of their pet delusion, even when they have absolutely nothing to support it. About all they have left is creating sockpuppets who, not entirely surprisingly, support them with equally non-existent evidence..
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All Hail МДЯЖ and LЄИИФИ.
???
Who are Mdyazh and Leiifi?
Behold an old Firesign Theatre album cover (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1116&bih=958&q=how+can+you+be+in+two+places+at+once+when+you%27re+not+anywhere+at+all&oq=how+can+you+be+in+&gs_l=img.3.1.0j0i24l9.1363.5189.0.6804.18.11.0.7.7.0.80.783.11.11.0...0.0...1ac.1.11.img.iNjZ_SLdvGs).
Fred
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All Hail МДЯЖ and LЄИИФИ.
???
Who are Mdyazh and Leiifi?
Close friends of Маркс and Ленин
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All Hail МДЯЖ and LЄИИФИ.
???
Who are Mdyazh and Leiifi?
Close friends of Маркс and Ленин
I think the first two might also be friends with Borat.
So "МДЯЖ" is the winner, with one letter correct, against zero for "LЄИИФИ."
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Incidentally, after seeing the TV series The Prisoner as a child, I find the Ukrainian letter Є to be somewhat creepy.
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Incidentally, after seeing the TV series The Prisoner as a child, I find the Ukrainian letter Є to be somewhat creepy.
I am Ukrainian-impaired, but in Russian, it's just the less common of the two "e" letters.
Now I have to go watch that show again ...
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Incidentally, after seeing the TV series The Prisoner as a child, I find the Ukrainian letter Є to be somewhat creepy.
I am Ukrainian-impaired, but in Russian, it's just the less common of the two "e" letters.
Now I have to go watch that show again ...
We want.... information.
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Incidentally, after seeing the TV series The Prisoner as a child, I find the Ukrainian letter Є to be somewhat creepy.
We use the font from The Prisoner's signage to label our conference rooms.
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I am Ukrainian-impaired, but in Russian, it's just the less common of the two "e" letters.
I think you're confusing Э with Є. The former is used in Russian and Belarusian, the latter in Ukrainian.
Now I have to go watch that show again ...
So do I. Too bad my library doesn't have it.
We use the font from The Prisoner's signage to label our conference rooms.
Yikes! I hope you don't decorate the rooms with penny-farthings.
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I think you're confusing Э with Є.
I don't know anything about Є, I just figured it was Э. Although I guess I should have figured out Є must exist in some language, or it wouldn't be computer-typable.