Author Topic: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked  (Read 12562 times)

Offline Bryanpoprobson

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #555 on: December 18, 2024, 09:24:20 AM »
Baron? We've already closed the book on that. You haven't seen the report so you cannot draw anything from it. Elderberries and hamsters, remember?
And why is it that we've not seen this 500-page report?  Why is it that we don't even hear NASA or congress making a deal of "where did it go?"  Instead, the NASA site's SUMMARY STILL proclaims it to have NEVER EXISTED.

And you don't smell fish.  You are stunning.

Only elderberries and hamsters.
And huge piles of horseshit.

"Wise men speak because they have something to say!" "Fools speak, because they have to say something!" (Plato)

Offline najak

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #556 on: December 18, 2024, 09:32:00 AM »
And as you're not a rocket scientist, why should we accept your statements about what the 'toughest part' is or isn't?
You don't have to accept it.  I guess you can wait and see how my spreadsheet works out for reasonably predicting the rocket trajectory.

I may also put this into the unity3D simulation game...  Show the two rockets side by side take off into space, showing readouts for their altitude, velocity, current acceleration, mass.

Offline najak

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #557 on: December 18, 2024, 09:36:56 AM »
I love this particular bollocks, there were issues in these tests, for instance; On Apollo 10 The LM went into an uncontrolled spin during the Ascent stage. This is why Apollo had this staged approach, to check each phase and as stated by another, even Apollo 11 was the first test landing (although this is contested by some).
If they were faking it, of course they need to insert some bugs/issues.   But note, never a fatality, nor any significant issue with "part/design" failure that demanded a delay to the schedule....  Not since 1967, with Apollo 1, when they couldn't even pass a 3-build comms test, or keep the crew alive while doing nothing. 

But they finally figured out the trick to fixing their QA/QC problem -- cut out 30% of the steps, and rush it.  Because that's how real life works; ask anyone who is doing any form of complex product development.

Offline Jason Thompson

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #558 on: December 18, 2024, 09:41:57 AM »
If they were faking it, of course they need to insert some bugs/issues.

This is why discussion with you is pointless. First it was suspect that they all worked fine. Once the problems are pointed out it's 'oh they put those in to make it look realistic'. As I said earlier on, any counter to your argument is dismissed as a cover up, or handwaved away by imagined weighted feathers or falsified documents.
"There's this idea that everyone's opinion is equally valid. My arse! Bloke who was a professor of dentistry for forty years does NOT have a debate with some eejit who removes his teeth with string and a door!"  - Dara O'Briain

Offline Jason Thompson

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #559 on: December 18, 2024, 09:43:47 AM »
And as you're not a rocket scientist, why should we accept your statements about what the 'toughest part' is or isn't?
You don't have to accept it.  I guess you can wait and see how my spreadsheet works out for reasonably predicting the rocket trajectory.

But as you're not  a rocket scientist, IF your spreadsheet doesn't match the stated performance closely enough, how will we know you used the correct calculations in your spreadsheet? Because with 50+ years and countless others who have examined those rockets, the likelihood you made a mistake is far higher than the likelihood you uncovered the smoking gun evidence of a massive fraud.
"There's this idea that everyone's opinion is equally valid. My arse! Bloke who was a professor of dentistry for forty years does NOT have a debate with some eejit who removes his teeth with string and a door!"  - Dara O'Briain

Offline Jason Thompson

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #560 on: December 18, 2024, 09:46:25 AM »


And by the way, here is the underside of the LLTV. Can you see the descent rockets now?
"There's this idea that everyone's opinion is equally valid. My arse! Bloke who was a professor of dentistry for forty years does NOT have a debate with some eejit who removes his teeth with string and a door!"  - Dara O'Briain

Offline onebigmonkey

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #561 on: December 18, 2024, 10:46:16 AM »
Baron? We've already closed the book on that. You haven't seen the report so you cannot draw anything from it. Elderberries and hamsters, remember?
And why is it that we've not seen this 500-page report?  Why is it that we don't even hear NASA or congress making a deal of "where did it go?"  Instead, the NASA site's SUMMARY STILL proclaims it to have NEVER EXISTED.

That's not what it says. The page makes it clear that it's reproducing material from the book "Chariots for Apollo".
« Last Edit: December 18, 2024, 10:50:20 AM by onebigmonkey »

Offline Mag40

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #562 on: December 18, 2024, 11:21:07 AM »
But this article you shared talks about VERTICAL center-of-mass -- ABOVE vs.  BELOW... and declared it to be BELOW...   Instead it's 2' ABOVE.
Alrighty, you go and fetch me the phrase that says that.
From your article, it concludes:
"because its main masses were located at or below the center of thrust of the motor and therefore its center of mass was quite low."

This is an Apollogist's Lie.  One which you digested as truth.  The MAJORITY OF THE MASS was ABOVE the center of thrust for this descent engine.
And of course you read that properly did you? It is talking about the centre of thrust. It talks about the "main masses" And you claimed it was talking about the vertical centre of mass.

The only thing worse than a bloody "rookie" rocket-engineer is an HB who thinks they can read sodding Wikipedia and acquire expert status. You make all this drivel about centre of mass when every rocket ever launched has it above the centre of thrust! It only needs to be along the line of the thrust with good balance.

You are the epitome of HB bingo.

Online ApolloEnthusiast

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #563 on: December 18, 2024, 11:22:47 AM »
I love this particular bollocks, there were issues in these tests, for instance; On Apollo 10 The LM went into an uncontrolled spin during the Ascent stage. This is why Apollo had this staged approach, to check each phase and as stated by another, even Apollo 11 was the first test landing (although this is contested by some).
If they were faking it, of course they need to insert some bugs/issues.   But note, never a fatality, nor any significant issue with "part/design" failure that demanded a delay to the schedule....  Not since 1967, with Apollo 1, when they couldn't even pass a 3-build comms test, or keep the crew alive while doing nothing. 

But they finally figured out the trick to fixing their QA/QC problem -- cut out 30% of the steps, and rush it.  Because that's how real life works; ask anyone who is doing any form of complex product development.
As Jason pointed out, you're (as usual) arguing out of both sides of your mouth. Things are too perfect to be authentic. Problems are pointed out. Those are just there to make it look real.

But you claim there was no delay to the schedule. Again, you demonstrate your complete lack of unfamiliarity with this topic. The LM was supposed to be tested on Apollo 8 but it wasn't ready. The whole reason Apollo 8 was sent to orbit the moon was to avoid the delay inherent in waiting for the LM or do a redundant mission that didn't actually advance the program. Just because demonstrably intelligent and creative people found a way to work within their situation to avoid the consequences of the delay doesn't mean it didn't happen.

The landing at Fra Mauro was delayed by 9 months. Perhaps you're familiar with Apollo 13? That was made into a movie, so it should be within the boundaries of your research capabilities.

It doesn't matter though, you'll find a way to dismiss this as another confirmation of your absurd unsupported conclusion. Anything that went well is too perfect. Anything that didn't go well was designed to make it look real. Any expert who works for or with NASA, no matter how thin the relationship, is a paid shill and can't be trusted. Anyone who doesn't work for or with NASA isn't professional or close enough to the situation to have any reliable knowledge. Your whole "argument" is just a con. You just don't realize that nobody here is dumb enough to fall for it.

Still waiting on you to demonstrate any looking in to the ISS vs Apollo docking situation. It's embarrassing to have to spoon feed you like this, but here is a little push in the right direction, champ. List the docking procedures for the ISS as you understand them and the docking procedures of the AM as you understand them. Compare and contrast and see if you can spot the difference. If you don't know the procedures, you may need to do a little digging, but this is something that even a lazy google search should be able to provide for you. 

Offline najak

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #564 on: December 18, 2024, 11:26:21 AM »
This is why discussion with you is pointless. First it was suspect that they all worked fine. Once the problems are pointed out it's 'oh they put those in to make it look realistic'. As I said earlier on, any counter to your argument is dismissed as a cover up, or handwaved away by imagined weighted feathers or falsified documents.
But these are reasonable responses.  It would be dumb for me to say "if they were faking it, they'd pretend all was immaculately perfect"...  my point was that "nothing significant went wrong" such as to interrupt their "mandatory aggressive corner-cutting schedule"...

Offline BertieSlack

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #565 on: December 18, 2024, 11:28:15 AM »

The only thing worse than a bloody "rookie" rocket-engineer is an HB who thinks they can read sodding Wikipedia and acquire expert status.

So the the LM was not "top-heavy" as he claimed?  :o

Offline najak

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #566 on: December 18, 2024, 11:30:05 AM »
But as you're not  a rocket scientist, IF your spreadsheet doesn't match the stated performance closely enough, how will we know you used the correct calculations in your spreadsheet? Because with 50+ years and countless others who have examined those rockets, the likelihood you made a mistake is far higher than the likelihood you uncovered the smoking gun evidence of a massive fraud.
My goal in this exercise is just general comparison... it's subject to some error, but if done right - should be with 20% error or much less.

I want to see if the SLS turns out to look "about HALF as good" as the Saturn.

If it turns out to be 70% as good - this too will bode well for Apollogists...  because at least it shows SaturnV as SIGNIFICANTLY BETTER.

I think it's going to show the opposite -- that SLS was "better than SaturnV"...    We'll soon find out.

Offline najak

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #567 on: December 18, 2024, 11:31:17 AM »
And by the way, here is the underside of the LLTV. Can you see the descent rockets now?
Thanks.  I'm not sure which part are these other descent rockets.   I can see the jet engine. :)

Offline najak

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #568 on: December 18, 2024, 11:35:06 AM »
That's not what it says. The page makes it clear that it's reproducing material from the book "Chariots for Apollo".
The NASA site says this: "When the tragedy occurred, Baron was apparently in the process of expanding his 55-page paper into a 500-page report."

As though it never existed.  Including a proven Lie from some other source, doesn't exonerate them from responsibility for showing this content.

This just means that a book writer ALSO LIES.   This "Chariots for Apollo" has been lauded by many Apollogists as a good book -- yet it lies about Baron, blatantly..

Offline Jason Thompson

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Re: Conclusive Proof the Moon Landings were Faked
« Reply #569 on: December 18, 2024, 11:35:29 AM »
And by the way, here is the underside of the LLTV. Can you see the descent rockets now?
Thanks.  I'm not sure which part are these other descent rockets.   I can see the jet engine. :)

Keep looking. They're on either side of the jet engine, and those grey spherical tanks held the fuel.

I must modify an earlier statement about the exhaust being steady state combustion. The descent rockets and the RCS were both monopropellant hydrogen peroxide motors, which use the rapid catalysed decomposition of hydrogen peroxide to generate thrust. There is no combustion involved.
"There's this idea that everyone's opinion is equally valid. My arse! Bloke who was a professor of dentistry for forty years does NOT have a debate with some eejit who removes his teeth with string and a door!"  - Dara O'Briain