False frame rates and a genius down under

[nomuse]

One of the drawbacks of the current state of the art in hearing aids is that they remove most of the localization cues (formed by fine changes in relative frequency content and phase by tiny reflections among the pinna of the external ear). This means that the Cocktail Party Effect is much diminished.

A similar experience comes when you attempt to record sound on location; since most setups lack those fine localization cues, again, environmental noise and the long tail of natural reverberation makes the recording seem much more "muddy" and "indistinct" than the sounds felt when listened to in person.

Incidentally, I have a friend who describes himself as tone deaf. He can actually carry a tune (if the bucket is large enough) but to him a flute sounds identical to a clarinet. He would, however, have no trouble telling a trumpet from a xylophone, because the attack and evolution of those sounds are so distinct.

(I suspect, also, that in a trumpet most of the energy is in harmonics of the fundamental after the starting transient, but in a xylophone multiple modes exist -- longitudinal versus transverse to the bars, for instance -- which are harmonically unrelated. And die out during the sustain, simplifying the timbre over time).

[Sus_pilot]

Most music sounds the same to me, I struggle to pick out tunes from music and if you played two notes at me I would probably not be able to tell you which was higher unless they were really far apart.  If you played half a dozen notes from a little tune, I'd be completely unable to tell you if the pitches went higher-higher-lower-higher etc.

That's not at all uncommon.  In contrast, I can hear the difference between the two Quindar tones -- those beeps on Apollo recordings that are the key-in key-out signals for the radio equipment.  They differ only by a fraction of a musical step.  But that's not common, but in any case -- as has been explained -- can be improved with training and practice.

I didn't know it was uncommon.  I thought everyone could hear the difference between the tones, since I could.

Interesting regarding the cocktail party effect:  when I'm flying with students, I can be talking to them while listening to air traffic control in very busy airspace, and somehow filter out everything but what is pertinent to our plane.  That is, not just calls to us, but calls to other aircraft that may be affecting us.  I have no clue how I do it...

[Peter B]

...I can hear the difference between the two Quindar tones -- those beeps on Apollo recordings that are the key-in key-out signals for the radio equipment.  They differ only by a fraction of a musical step.  But that's not common, but in any case -- as has been explained -- can be improved with training and practice.

I didn't know it was uncommon.  I thought everyone could hear the difference between the tones, since I could.

Same for me. I wonder that my advantage was having two professional musicians for parents and growing up in a house full of music.

Interesting regarding the cocktail party effect:  when I'm flying with students, I can be talking to them while listening to air traffic control in very busy airspace, and somehow filter out everything but what is pertinent to our plane.  That is, not just calls to us, but calls to other aircraft that may be affecting us.  I have no clue how I do it...

I'm not sure it's related to the cocktail effect, but my oldest son has problems with this. He's profoundly deaf and has worn bilateral cochlear implants since he was one. He's now six, and we're dealing with the issues of extraneous noise in classrooms (he attends the local primary school). Initially we got him an FM receiver - his teacher wears a lapel mic which is transmitted into one of his implants in addition to what he hears through the implants. Now we also have a hand-held cordless microphone which can be handed around the class to make it easier for him to hear his classmates as well.

Of course, things don't always take expected paths. A couple of days ago we took him to the Implant Centre so they could return his implants with new software. While the upgrade was being done he wore a pair of loaner implants. Then, as we drove him back to school, he announced that while he'd been wearing the loaner implants my voice sounded like a pirate... *sigh* We think he means the loaners made my voice sound deeper and rougher, but it's hard to be sure. But it's hard to get coherent information about subtle acoustic effects from a six year old...

(But we are grateful he can hear.)

[Noldi400]

Interesting regarding the cocktail party effect:  when I'm flying with students, I can be talking to them while listening to air traffic control in very busy airspace, and somehow filter out everything but what is pertinent to our plane.  That is, not just calls to us, but calls to other aircraft that may be affecting us.  I have no clue how I do it...

I think it's just something your brain learns to do.  I had much the same experience in emergency services. You can be riding along, gabbing with your partner or whatever, while there's a more-or-less constant stream of chatter from the radio;  even if you're not paying attention, if your unit number is called or your specific alert tones go off, you hear it right away.

[sts60]

Yes, and the quiet beeping of the box alarm pre-alert tones can cause a bunk room full of guys and gals (who have been snoring peacefully through the radio chatter over the PA) to sit bolt upright listening for the dispatch area... 

[Noldi400]

Yes, and the quiet beeping of the box alarm pre-alert tones can cause a bunk room full of guys and gals (who have been snoring peacefully through the radio chatter over the PA) to sit bolt upright listening for the dispatch area...

Yup. You'll wake up to your own alert tones even before the relays have time to set off the loud alarm.

[raven]

A mum will hear her own baby's cry over noses *very* well, and most of us have probably heard our own names at times when everything else was an aural blur.

[Noldi400]

A mum will hear her own baby's cry over noses *very* well, and most of us have probably heard our own names at times when everything else was an aural blur.

Well, truthfully, noses aren't usually very loud, although there are exceptions.
**I'm really, really sorry. I just couldn't stop myself.**

On a side note, that's why my Mom taught me at a young age to call her name if we ever got separated in a crowd - there's always some kid yelling "Mom!" so she figured she would hear me better and sooner.

[Andromeda]

That's another struggle for me - it's almost impossible to get my attention without waving or jumping up and down in front of me.  It's embarrassing, especially when other people realise this person is trying to get my attention long before I do.

[gillianren]

A mum will hear her own baby's cry over noses *very* well, and most of us have probably heard our own names at times when everything else was an aural blur.

I can tell you from personal experience that it doesn't have to be cries, either.  I can hear his Happy Noises at a distance, too.

Andromeda, I promise you that if I'm ever trying to get your attention, I will walk up to you and do it directly.  You know, for all those times we get together.

[Luke Pemberton]

A mum will hear her own baby's cry over noses *very* well, and most of us have probably heard our own names at times when everything else was an aural blur.

I can tell you from personal experience that it doesn't have to be cries, either.  I can hear his Happy Noises at a distance, too.

I haven't shown myself at the board until recently, it has been a while. Just before my breaking from the Internet world you announced the impending arrival.

I hope you are both doing well.

[Andromeda]

A mum will hear her own baby's cry over noses *very* well, and most of us have probably heard our own names at times when everything else was an aural blur.

I can tell you from personal experience that it doesn't have to be cries, either.  I can hear his Happy Noises at a distance, too.

Andromeda, I promise you that if I'm ever trying to get your attention, I will walk up to you and do it directly.  You know, for all those times we get together.

 

[gillianren]

I hope you are both doing well.

He's got a bit of a cold right now, but he's doing fine other than that.  Eight months this week, and he's simply huge.  He's starting to make attempts at walking unsupported, having mastered standing and pulling himself along things.

[raven]

Aw, I remember when you two were telling us he was about to be born.
Already eight months, wow.

[gillianren]

Last night, we started seriously putting him in his crib for the night.  (Graham doesn't have class for two weeks, so one of us can sleep on the futon in his room without having to get up in the morning--and it won't always be me.)  He's adorable to snuggle with, but not when you're trying to actually sleep.