JFK - 3 shooters 6 shots

[profmunkin]

Is that diagram an accurate depiction of the location of the wound. Yes or no? Feel free to consult Google if you want.

I realized your suggestion is the best, to go to the source.

[profmunkin]

Of the 10 men in follow up car that were the closest witnesses of the assassination.
Emory Roberts - did not testify under oath to the WC
George Hickey - did not testify under oath to the WC
David Powers - did not testify under oath to the WC
Glen Bennett - did not testify under oath to the WC
Samual Kinney - did not testify under oath to the WC
Paul Landis - did not testify under oath to the WC
John Ready - did not testify under oath to the WC
William McIntyre - did not testify under oath to the WC

[ka9q]

Of the 10 men in follow up car that were the closest witnesses of the assassination.

So what? The Commission directly interviewed only the most important witnesses. That included both agents in the limo (driver Greer and agent in charge Kellerman), one from the followup car (Clint Hill, who ran to Jackie's aid) and one from Vice President Johnson's car (Youngblood).

Most Commission witnesses gave depositions in which a staff lawyer asks questions and produces a written transcript for the record. Depositions are a very important part of the preparation of most US legal cases. In some cases, the Commission decided to bring in and interview a witness who had already given a deposition. A few witnesses gave affidavits, which are written statements. In addition, nearly every Secret Service agent involved in the Dallas trip, including those in the followup car, made a written report soon after the assassination while their memories were still fresh.

What more do you want? Exactly what additional useful information would be gained by having the Commission directly interview every single person in the followup car or anywhere in Dealy Plaza? Or are you just throwing darts randomly at the Warren Commission, hoping against hope to get lucky?

[twik]

So far I have uncovered 62 people that stated within their testimony that they were aware of a rhythm to the reports.

44 said it was Bham...Bham-Bham they claimed the last two reports were "simultaneous" or "like automic rifle fire" or "quick" or "rapid". 4 others stated there were 4 shots Bham...Bham-Bham-Bham and another 4 had the order reversed Bham-Bham...Bham

Only 6 people thought the reports had been evenly spaced Bham...Bham...Bham

I'm not sure how you think this helps your position. It clearly indicates that people were confused by the acoustics, and were having a hard time remembering the exact details.

In other words, whatever happened left "anomalies" simply because that is human nature.

[Chew]

Of the 10 men in follow up car that were the closest witnesses of the assassination.
Emory Roberts - did not testify under oath to the WC
George Hickey - did not testify under oath to the WC
David Powers - did not testify under oath to the WC
Glen Bennett - did not testify under oath to the WC
Samual Kinney - did not testify under oath to the WC
Paul Landis - did not testify under oath to the WC
John Ready - did not testify under oath to the WC
William McIntyre - did not testify under oath to the WC

Is this the reason you felt justified about lying when you said most of them did not know where the shots came from when in fact the vast majority said they came from the rear or right rear?

[Chew]

Of the 10 men in follow up car that were the closest witnesses of the assassination.
Emory Roberts - did not testify under oath to the WC
George Hickey - did not testify under oath to the WC
David Powers - did not testify under oath to the WC
Glen Bennett - did not testify under oath to the WC
Samual Kinney - did not testify under oath to the WC
Paul Landis - did not testify under oath to the WC
John Ready - did not testify under oath to the WC
William McIntyre - did not testify under oath to the WC

Is this the reason you felt justified about lying when you said almost all of them did not know where the shots came from when in fact the vast majority said they came from the rear or right rear?

[profmunkin]

But as for changing the established conclusions of the many investigations of the JFK assassination...sorry, but no. Just no.

Of the 12 SS and aids in the first 2 cars
7 reported a spacing of the shots
6 of these men stated Bham...Bham.Bham
1 had it reversed, stated Bham.Bham...Bham (dyslexia is my guess)

Then again trained proffessionals could not as McIntyre said "none of us could determine the origin of the shots" (They "all" supposidly looked toward the TSBD, NONE of them saw anything unusual, my personal opinion is they were looking the wrong direction)
Also interesting because there were a few nit wits that claimed to see the gun protruding as much as "3 feet" out the 6th floor window.

Why do you suppose John Ready was called back when he started to go to JFK's aid, did anyone ask Emory Roberts why he recalled Ready?

Wouldn't it have been interesting to get these guys under oath and grill them to find out why none of them moved to protect the president and why Greer took an extremly wide left turn onto Elm, then slowed the limo down almost to a stop right after the first shot was fired.

Kellerman claims right after the first shot, he heard JFK say he was hit, 5 - 6 second later JFK is dead the limo is still proding down Elm and Kellerman who should have jumped over the seats to protect the president is in the front seat ducking down and yelling go go go or whatever.

Martin, limo speed down Elm estimated at "4 to 5 miles per hour"
"after the third shot it had almost come to a stop, it was going very slow"
Evidence in Z film as motorcycle overtakes the limo Z-333

Interesting note from Kinney, driver of followup car "At  this time I glanced from the taillights of the Presidents car, that I use for gauging distances for driving" probably innocent, but interesting that it is mentioned, the conspiracy side says Greer applied the brakes, hence the lights came on and Kinney looked up to see why Greer was applying the brakes, goes with Hargis and Martin riding up unexpectedly overtaking the back of the limo.

You guys need to at least try and incorporate some facts into your fantasy story, it would make it more believable if you used any facts at all.

[ka9q]

You guys need to at least try and incorporate some facts into your fantasy story, it would make it more believable if you used any facts at all.

For you of all people to say this to us is really offensive. Try not lying about the evidence for a change.

[profmunkin]

What more do you want? Exactly what additional useful information would be gained by having the Commission directly interview every single person in the followup car or anywhere in Dealy Plaza? Or are you just throwing darts randomly at the Warren Commission, hoping against hope to get lucky?

The WC found it necessary to have James Romack and George Rackley testify to the WC concerning pigeons, even though they were a block north of the TSBD on Houston, never saw the motorcade but just saw pigeons flying off the roof after the reports, no one mentions pigeons probably flew off every building around Dealey Plaza and the RR yards at the reports.

Side note, here is the deception, McAdams reports that these two witnesses claimed the shots came from the TSBD and account them in this category. The TSBD was a block south of their position and the knoll was south of that, of course the sound of the reports would be toward the TSBD that is the only place the sound would come from, this is just asinine.

So the WC had time for these pigeon witnesses, but not for SS men 20 feet away.
YES sworn in, testimonies of every one in the car as well as everyone known to be a witness in the Plaza

YES without exception and cross examined by Oswald's defense.

[ka9q]

Why do you suppose John Ready was called back when he started to go to JFK's aid, did anyone ask Emory Roberts why he recalled Ready?

No one had to ask Roberts because he explained exactly why in his report soon after the assassination:

12:30 pm. First of three shots fired, at which time I saw the President lean toward Mrs. Kennedy. I do not know if it was the next shot or third shot that hit the President in the head, but I saw what appeared to be a small explosion on the right side of the President's head, saw blood, at which time the President fell further to his left. Mrs. Kennedy was leaning toward the President, however, she immediately raised up in the seat and appeared to be getting up on back of same. About this time I saw SA Clinton Hill trying to get on left rear step of the President's car. He got aboard and climbed up over the back of the car and placed himself over the President and Mrs. Kennedy. After SA Hill got on rear step of the President's car it appeared that SA John Ready was about to follow and go for the right rear step, however, I told him not to jump, as we had picked up speed, and I was afraid he could not make it.

So there you have it. JFK had already been mortally shot, Clint Hill had already reached the back of the limousine -- too late -- and they were picking up speed for their race to the hospital. What exactly could Ready have done at this point to justify the very real risk of his being run over by the followup car? Would you be happier if a few of the agents had immediately committed suicide to atone for not having protected JFK?

Of course I expect this simple recitation of facts and logic to have little or no effect on you.

[profmunkin]

I'm not sure how you think this helps your position. It clearly indicates that people were confused by the acoustics, and were having a hard time remembering the exact details.

In other words, whatever happened left "anomalies" simply because that is human nature.

Not at all, what this shows is that whatever a person has their attention on, that becomes part of their experience, some people are more visual some are audio.
The problem is you have to discount the majority opinion in every category I have posted to maintain your position. 
The witnesses testimonies do not support the WC report.
Not surprising since they made it up.

[ka9q]

The WC found it necessary to have James Romack and George Rackley testify to the WC concerning pigeons, even though they were a block north of the TSBD on Houston

Like many witnesses, Romack and Rackley were deposed. They did not testify directly to the Commission.

I looked at part of Romack's testimony. It is obvious he was interviewed for his observations of what happened at the rear of the building immediately after the assassination: who came out, who went in, when the police sealed it off, etc. It had to do with far more than just pigeons. These are very relevant issues even if you can't or won't see them.

So once again you misstate the testimony.

YES sworn in, testimonies of every one in the car as well as everyone known to be a witness in the Plaza

Maybe this is because the Warren Commission had a large staff of trained and experienced investigators who knew what information was especially important, while you're a biased, ideological, untrained and inexperienced layman desperately trying to find something, anything with which to deny the results of that and other investigations. Whether or not it's true.

[gillianren]

You know, the Warren Commission was based out of Washington, DC.  The assassination took place in Dallas.  That means one of two things would have been necessary.  Either huge sums of money would have been expended bringing witnesses to Washington so they could testify despite affidavits being perfectly legally binding and conducted by lawyers who doubtless asked the same range of questions the Commission members would have or else the commission would have had to travel to Dallas and spend a considerable length of time there despite having obligations in Washington which would not permit in-depth questioning of every witness.  It strikes me that getting affidavits from most witnesses and only directly examining a handful of them is a lot more sensible than either of those.  But since when did sense enter into conspiracism?

[Jason Thompson]

Let us use the autopsy photos as you suggested, instead of relying on a depiction?

Are you suggesting that we are somehow obstructing you from doing so? Good grief, get off your proverbial backside and do your own research. You have been told why the links and pictures will not be posted here, and how to find them yourself. Get on with it and stop wasting time trying to make out we're not playing fair.

And by the way, most of us have already been using the photos in our discussions. Just because we haven't posted them here doesn't mean we haven't looked at them.

[Jason Thompson]

I realized your suggestion is the best, to go to the source.

A realisation that any halfway competent researcher would have come to before drawing any conclusions whatsovever.