Tindarormkimcha's thread

[onebigmonkey]

They did have some simulations for landing approach, down to 1:150 scale.

When I was looking at Apollo 15 LRO imagery I found this thread:

http://spacetime.forumotion.com/t742-apollo-lunar-mission-simulators

and did some comparisons of the shots in the LOLA video there at 5000' with an LRO image overlaid on Google Moon and Apollo 15:



sadly, when you get down to 3000' and look closely it starts to fall apart a bit:



The arrows identify the same features in each image, where possible.

[dwight]

Zakalwe, if you are interested I have several bits of documentation on the sim setup. One was IIRC published in SMPTE because of its innovative TV arangement. I will need to dig them up though.

Yes please!

Oh no! That means I have to find them!!!

[Zakalwe]

Lol. No worries if you can't dig them out.

Sounds like you employ a similar "piling" system to me!

[dwight]

OK you are in luck. I have 3 docs and I'm uploading them to dropbox now. I will send you the link via PM. Anyone else who wants them can PM me. If you are a hoax nut, then add $450 to your request, payable up front.

Update: PM sent, mate.

[bknight]

OK you are in luck. I have 3 docs and I'm uploading them to dropbox now. I will send you the link via PM. Anyone else who wants them can PM me. If you are a hoax nut, then add $450 to your request, payable up front.

Update: PM sent, mate.

You're too easy

[Luckmeister]

If you are a hoax nut, then add $450 to your request, payable up front.

Watch out. They pay in hoaxbucks.

[smartcooky]

To put it simply, Tindarormkimcha, reality has its own weight, while computer simulation must simulate the world itself. If you drop a ball, you don't need to do any calculations, but a simulation of dropping a ball would.
It's noteworthy that I have found no mention of the computer claims in Bill Kaysing's book, at least the preview on Google Books, despite being nearly contemporary with Apollo. This kind of claim comes from people who don't realize just how astounding the advances of computers have been. People hold in their pockets computers comparable to the supercomputers of the nineteen eighties.

The thing is that the "AGC-wasn't-powerful-enough-to-navigate-to-the-moon" crowd don't even realise that, if push comes to shove, you don't even need a computer at all to navigate to the moon. You could do it with a sextant, a table of lunar orbital predictions (called an ephemeris), a slide rule and a window to see out of. It would take a lot more time to do the math, and be more prone to error so it would require lots of checking and rechecking.

[dwight]

OK you are in luck. I have 3 docs and I'm uploading them to dropbox now. I will send you the link via PM. Anyone else who wants them can PM me. If you are a hoax nut, then add $450 to your request, payable up front.

Update: PM sent, mate.

You're too easy

I know, but then I am a lier, mate. Or is it a lyer?

[dwight]

If you are a hoax nut, then add $450 to your request, payable up front.

Watch out. They pay in hoaxbucks.

Oh no! I didn't think of that. Always catching me off guard they is.

[raven]

It was known as Project LOLA- Lunar Orbit and Landing Approach, which consisted of four separate models to simulate the Moon from 200 miles up.

http://www.nasa.gov/centers/langley/multimedia/project-lola.html#.Vbk3nfmIlZg

https://archive.org/details/1964-L-05924

https://archive.org/search.php?query=LOLA%20simulator

Yet again, I learn something in the process of attempting to educate others. I admit, I didn't know the name or details of the project, I just knew something like that was the most reasonable explanation for its use.  And, what do you know, I was right.
I guess I just don't cut it as a conspiracy theorist, lol.

The thing is that the "AGC-wasn't-powerful-enough-to-navigate-to-the-moon" crowd don't even realise that, if push comes to shove, you don't even need a computer at all to navigate to the moon. You could do it with a sextant, a table of lunar orbital predictions (called an ephemeris), a slide rule and a window to see out of. It would take a lot more time to do the math, and be more prone to error so it would require lots of checking and rechecking.

Reminds me of the British Interplanetary Society's moon rocket plans, from the late 1930's. Or, for that matter, Gordon Cooper and Mercury-Atlas 7.

[Kiwi]

For Tindarormkimcha

Since you are so interested in popular writings on Apollo.  Here is a well written layman's article put up on Ars Technica about the guidance computer and the program alarms that threatened the A11 landing.

http://arstechnica.com/science/2015/07/no-a-checklist-error-did-not-almost-derail-the-first-moon-landing/

Thank you very much for that link, Echnaton -- it's an excellent piece of writing, very educational, and well worth saving.  If Tindarormkimcha doesn't appreciate it, at least many of the regulars here will.

While I quickly scanned most of the article, focused on a few bits, and still have to read everything closely, one thing really stood out:  It's the first recently-written history of an aspect of Apollo in which, for a change, I didn't see any errors. This is a real credit to the author -- it's obvious that he did his homework, unlike some other recent writers. In fact, I've got used to scanning articles quickly to see if they contain some of the more common errors.

[Echnaton]

Thank you very much for that link, Echnaton -- it's an excellent piece of writing, very educational, and well worth saving.  If Tindarormkimcha doesn't appreciate it, at least many of the regulars here will.

While I quickly scanned most of the article, focused on a few bits, and still have to read everything closely, one thing really stood out:  It's the first recently-written history of an aspect of Apollo in which, for a change, I didn't see any errors. This is a real credit to the author -- it's obvious that he did his homework, unlike some other recent writers. In fact, I've got used to scanning articles quickly to see if they contain some of the more common errors.

I really didn't post it for Tinkar because I recognize that, like everyone else here, nothing we say will make a difference to him.   But it fit in with his posting/ranting so was appropriate and this is a good place to share links to good Apollo articles anyone of us come across. 

The writer, Lee Hutchinson is from League City, a small city near the the JSC and lives somewhere in Houston.  As a writer for a tech news site, he typically put great care into his reporting.  As with much online journalism, Ars Technica has something of the post first and make corrections later attitude.  As Jay commented above, the article covers the vagaries of technology design and engineering and just how much work it takes to do, what would otherwise be a much more straight forward design, when lives are on the line and full up testing is limited to a few events.

On the other hand, maybe the moon is a hollow constructed body full of Nazi clones biding their time until they spring out to invade the world. Only Tinkar would know for sure.   

[Zakalwe]

So is that it from Tinda-wahhisface? A drive-by, machine-gun, gish-gallop of clapped out drivel that's been debunked so many times it should have a bus-pass by now? Has he puffed himself out with all that copy-and-pasting, or is there more to come? He's still logging in and lurking, so he's reading this....

It's very evident that the hoax routine has pretty much run it's course now, isn't it? There's nothing new for them to offer. The Blunder tries but just makes himself look foolish by using big words and sums that he can't understand, Adrian van Weereld lives in a fantasy, paranoid world where he wears his underpants on the outside and imagines he is leading a shadowy organisation. Then you have the braying YouTube generation, such as our recent wee man, that can only regurgitate nonsense without any understanding of the words they are using.

[DD Brock]

Agreed on all points. It seems like they are running out of gas. I wonder if this flat Earth thing I was until very recently blissfully unaware of is simply the hoaxies moving on to new territory?

Now totally off topic, but your avatar is freaking me the bleepity-bleep out, lol!

[Zakalwe]

Now totally off topic, but your avatar is freaking me the bleepity-bleep out, lol!

You should see me in real life....