FAR SIDE OF THE MOON

[bknight]

I'm not whining, when I say that I am only against a dozen and speak the language problem is in response to your complaints that I'm not responding. CSM regarding the lunar module, it is possible that it is an error of judgment on my part, because of not being able to prove my point, I decided not to continue discussing this.
Finally, the reason for choosing this English-speaking forum to discuss these issues is because I have not found any Spanish-speaking people who know much about a subject as here, appreciate and value the knowledge and ability displayed by some users this forum, because they can learn things and correct errors, for example the case of CSM. And Jay is right when he says it was a mistake to open as many threads would have been better to exhaust first, sorry.

With respect to gif Pluto, it is assumed that these images are obtained by the probe as it approaches the planet, having said that, I disagree with the argument of the distance, a distant object should be small, but as it approaches should be growing in size, it makes no sense to publish blur and even pixilated, especially if one wants to try something ... a blurred pebble and black background manufactures anyone in awhile on the PC.

I would read the answer to my previous contribution on the far side of the moon, adding more doubt ... how far away the moon this picture was taken?



I do not know if this image was obtained by the CSM as it orbited the Moon or LM, in any case limited to the height at which they were traveling could not portray the Moon in full size. The image mosaic part this photo suggests that the spacecraft moved away from the satellite, which would be right for the return trip, but the problem is that it is the opposite side of the Moon, traveled in the opposite direction Earth for this picture? and what happens with the date of April 25, with the return to Earth just two days later? all this seems at odds with the flight plan released NASA.

It was recorded after TEI during the trip back to earth

[Abaddon]

I'm not whining,

Yes you are

when I say that I am only against a dozen

What did you think would happen when you posted so much nonsense?

and speak the language problem is in response to your complaints that I'm not responding.

Yet somehow you can respond. I don't buy it for a moment.

CSM regarding the lunar module, it is possible that it is an error of judgment on my part,

Ya think? You have been abjectly wrong on everything you have claimed so far. You will likely be wrong on everything you claim henceforth.

because of not being able to prove my point,

Yet that gave you no pause for thought. Why is it that you cannot prove your point? Did you think for a moment why that might be?

I decided not to continue discussing this.

Why?

Finally, the reason for choosing this English-speaking forum to discuss these issues is because I have not found any Spanish-speaking people who know much about a subject as here, appreciate and value the knowledge and ability displayed by some users this forum, because they can learn things and correct errors, for example the case of CSM. And Jay is right when he says it was a mistake to open as many threads would have been better to exhaust first, sorry.

It matters not a whit how many threads you open. It is a tactic that is so jaded that nobody cares anymore. We have seen it all before and done it all before.

Somehow, you thought it was new. Turns out you are wrong. Again.

With respect to gif Pluto, it is assumed that these images are obtained by the probe as it approaches the planet,

Except that it is not.

having said that, I disagree with the argument of the distance, a distant object should be small, but as it approaches should be growing in size, it makes no sense to publish blur and even pixilated, especially if one wants to try something ... a blurred pebble and black background manufactures anyone in awhile on the PC.

Wrong again on so many levels.

I would read the answer to my previous contribution on the far side of the moon, adding more doubt ... how far away the moon this picture was taken?

So you didn't bother finding out? What a lovely researcher you are. Why exactly should anyone bother with an image you decline to identify?

I do not know if this image was obtained by the CSM as it orbited the Moon or LM,

Why do you not know? Did you do no research? Do you expect everyone else to do your research on your behalf?

in any case limited to the height at which they were traveling could not portray the Moon in full size.

You think every probe travels at the same height?

The image mosaic part this photo suggests that the spacecraft moved away from the satellite, which would be right for the return trip, but the problem is that it is the opposite side of the Moon, traveled in the opposite direction Earth for this picture? and what happens with the date of April 25, with the return to Earth just two days later? all this seems at odds with the flight plan released NASA.

That is incoherent. Which flight plan? How do mosaics have anything to do with orbital mechanics?  Sure, one can stitch imagery together and so forth and sure the resolution will be affected by proximity, but bluntly, Newton doesn't much care.

[Abaddon]

It was recorded after TEI during the trip back to earth

IIRC it was circa 40,000 klicks, but I could be wrong.
I any event, tarkus has yet again failed to note focal length etc.

My eldest daughter (13) is actually better than me at working this out. I calculate it out when I am behind the lens. She instantaneously does it. I remain astonished.

[bknight]

It was recorded after TEI during the trip back to earth

IIRC it was circa 40,000 klicks, but I could be wrong.
I any event, tarkus has yet again failed to note focal length etc.

My eldest daughter (13) is actually better than me at working this out. I calculate it out when I am behind the lens. She instantaneously does it. I remain astonished.

http://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a16/AS16-131-20163HR.jpg here it is, but there is no data on what time it was taken.

[Abaddon]

It was recorded after TEI during the trip back to earth

A8, A9, A11, A12, A13, A14, A15, A16 or A17?

All of them had TEI so which one?
You don't have the foggiest.

Focal length? You don't have the foggiest either?

Which camera? You don't know that either.

Camera settings? Nope, do not have the remotest clue.

Do you know anything?

I am minded of the movie "the Untouchables"... You brought a shoehorn to a rocket launch.

Now, I don't object to that as long as the shoehorn wielder is willing to learn as I have done, and is willing to admit they are wrong as I have done.

What I object to is those who refuse point blank to accept they are wrong despite all evidence.

[bknight]

It was recorded after TEI during the trip back to earth

A8, A9, A11, A12, A13, A14, A15, A16 or A17?

All of them had TEI so which one?
You don't have the foggiest.

Focal length? You don't have the foggiest either?

Which camera? You don't know that either.

Camera settings? Nope, do not have the remotest clue.

Do you know anything?

I am minded of the movie "the Untouchables"... You brought a shoehorn to a rocket launch.

Now, I don't object to that as long as the shoehorn wielder is willing to learn as I have done, and is willing to admit they are wrong as I have done.

What I object to is those who refuse point blank to accept they are wrong despite all evidence.

Sorry, it was A16

[Abaddon]

http://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a16/AS16-131-20163HR.jpg here it is, but there is no data on what time it was taken.

Not remotely close to the pic Tarkus quoted.

But which picture did he in fact cite? AS-16-3021.

No such exists. Either he is ignorant of the nomenclature or intentionally obfuscating the image used and these are not mutually exclusive.

I could seek the image to which he refers, but why? Surely it is up to him to provide actual references, no?

[AtomicDog]

Tarkus - you don't make it clear, but I assume that the photo was taken two days from reentry, and that you have a problem with that. Keep in mind that the CSM is speeding up as it leaves lunar orbit due to Earth's stronger gravity, and can cover well over two thirds the distance home in two days.

[Abaddon]

Sorry, it was A16

No big deal. I was addressing tarkus, not you.

[Abaddon]

Tarkus - you don't make it clear, but I assume that the photo was taken two days from reentry, and that you have a problem with that. Keep in mind that the CSM is speeding up as it leaves lunar orbit due to Earth's stronger gravity, and can cover well over two thirds the distance home in two days.

I believe you are being overly optomistic as to what tarkus can handle.

[JayUtah]

Finally, the reason for choosing this English-speaking forum to discuss these issues is because I have not found any Spanish-speaking people who know much about a subject as here, appreciate and value the knowledge and ability displayed by some users this forum...

Then understand that you will have to learn to communicate in English.  Not just conversational English, but the English required to discuss complex, specialized topics.

...a distant object should be small, but as it approaches should be growing in size, it makes no sense to publish blur and even pixilated

A distant object is small in the photo.  The only way to make it of comparable size to photographs taken from nearby is to resize and crop that portion of the distant photo.  You can't do that without making it blurry.  This is basic photography.  The recording medium has a natural resolution.  When you magnify what it records, it doesn't magically add data that the original medium was unable to record.

This has been explained two you twice.  Stop being so arrogant and think carefully about what people are trying to tell you.

[onebigmonkey]

http://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a16/AS16-131-20163HR.jpg here it is, but there is no data on what time it was taken.

Not remotely close to the pic Tarkus quoted.

But which picture did he in fact cite? AS-16-3021.

No such exists. Either he is ignorant of the nomenclature or intentionally obfuscating the image used and these are not mutually exclusive.

I could seek the image to which he refers, but why? Surely it is up to him to provide actual references, no?

I identified the image for him on page one

As for when exactly it was taken, and the altitude, it is not difficult - I just checked. The AFJ transcript contains the details of when the camera was turned on and off, and the PAO makes regular announcements during the TEI process as to their position relative to the moon.

Tarkus either knows where the information is, in which case he can find it, or he doesn't have a clue, in which case he has no business passing comment.

[Zakalwe]

CSM regarding the lunar module, it is possible that it is an error of judgment on my part, because of not being able to prove my point, I decided not to continue discussing this.

Nearly, and yet so far. It's more than possible- it absolutely was an error on your part. You got it wrong, it was as simple as that. And then you decided to bury that in a gish-gallop and hope that no-one would notice.

However, at least you are beginning to recognise that you can be in error and that notions that you held are based on nothing more than errors in your thinking. It's an important point and one that you should think further on. There's no shame in being wrong and no-one here will mock anyone for being corrected. Continuing to argue when the evidence is shoved under your nose will attract opprobrium though.

[Jason Thompson]

I'm not whining, when I say that I am only against a dozen and speak the language problem is in response to your complaints that I'm not responding.

It is not adequate. You have been asked the same question repeatedly by me several times, and the same subject has been discussed by others. In the time it has taken you to write these responses and drag more arguments to the table you could have answered the one simple question: how big will Earth appear to be from 800,000 km?

CSM regarding the lunar module, it is possible that it is an error of judgment on my part, because of not being able to prove my point, I decided not to continue discussing this.

But you waited until now to acknowledge your mistake. Why?

Finally

No, not finally. You still have not answered the question: how big will Earth appear to be from 800,000 km? All the tools you need to answer that question are right here in this thread, as well as in countless online resources. Please just answer this one question.

because they can learn things and correct errors, for example the case of CSM.

So why has it taken you so long to acknowledge your mistakes and errors when they have been pointed out to you so many times?

With respect to gif Pluto, it is assumed that these images are obtained by the probe as it approaches the planet,

Why assume anything? The source of the images is freely available online.

a distant object should be small, but as it approaches should be growing in size,

It is growing in size. But if it starts out at 3 pixels wide, how many pixels wide will it have to be before it doesn't look blurry?

it makes no sense to publish blur and even pixilated, especially if one wants to try something

Wrong. Even a blurred image tells us new things. Who knew before the pictures were published that Pluto's moon Kerberos has two lobes?  Even with a blurred image we have learned a significant fact we didn't know before. Only laymen think all images should be crisp and detailed to be of value.

I do not know if this image was obtained by the CSM as it orbited the Moon or LM,

Neither. It was taken on the return journey to Earth, from some considerable distance.

Now, for the third time in this post alone, how big will Earth appear from 800,000 km if it is 2 degrees wide from 400,000 km? Can we expect an answer to this any time soon?

[Luke Pemberton]

Guys, I'm used to being ignored by the HBs, but I pointed out in post 292 that Tarkus hadn't been the one to initially post that image.

Not ignoring you here, just not following the thread properly. I have back pain at the moment, so sitting at a computer is not the most comfortable activity and focus on the detail is poor. The muscles between my shoulder blades cramped up 2 weeks ago and I'm in some discomfort. It is the reason that I am not partaking in the thread as much as I normally do.