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1

The Hoax Theory / Re: Hoax? - Lunar Launches - Too Fast

« Last post by Jason Thompson on Today at 06:03:07 AM »

Even if we didn't land men on the moon, they are all Patriots, carrying the burden of secrecy about a celebrated public narrative.  This was an operation run by the DoD, with the "excuse" of "fooling the Russians"... even if their excuse was disingenuous.  The Astronauts are all Patriotic military men, except one - and he's a patriot too.  If they had spilled-the-beans, it would have been Treason.   We "won a war" without firing a shot.  Kudos.

Another tick on the bingo card, thanks.

To be sure they went, I'm looking at the most compelling proofs that they didn't so that I can weigh them, see if they stand.  I won't find many good answers inside MLH forums, only here where there is extreme resistance.

Why don't you try looking at the whole thing and understanding it? The amount of stuff published about Apollo (and the rest of the space program, which you simply cannot ignore for the context it provides) is vast. Most Apollo deniers in my experience don't look at it because it is also complex and they lack the ability to understand it, or the willingness to try. A few questions or things you can't understand in there don't invalidate the rest. Your use of the word 'compelling' is informative, since it implies a preference for arguments that appeal to your preference rather than an objective analysis.

If we've got to lie and hide to protect NASA's claims - this doesn't sit well with me.  So if there are MLH proofs that hold any merit, I want to present them accurately.

Personally, I'm seeing too many instances of "breaking physics" for me to just ignore them.   So I'm digging down deep, to see if any of it holds water.  This shouldn't piss you off.
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2

The Hoax Theory / Re: Hoax? - Sand Falls too Fast.

« Last post by najak on Today at 06:01:53 AM »

@Mag40 - your video of the Hippity -- SHOWS the dust falling FASTER than Cernan!

The fact that it doesn't fully stop it's horizontal motion, is expected.   It rises with his boot... to the boot level... then FALLS FASTER!!...  then scuttles along the ground until it hits a high spot.

No, you are simply dead wrong on this. I can see clearly what Mag40 points out.

Great - take an image snapshot mid-way - where the dust is all on the ground, while the astronaut is still at apex - and show me how this dust is also "still at apex"..  If Cernan is still at apex, but the dust is not -- then the dust has fallen down FASTER than Cernan.

Please show me how the dust remained at apex along with Cernan.

Also - if it were following the path declared by Mag40, and falling to the ground at the same time (even though we see NONE of this suspended dust at apex)....  it would NOT ALL FALL IN THE SAME EXACT SPOT FOR 1/3rd of a second!!...  it would be chaotic.    HOWEVER, if instead the dust is scuttling across the ground (which it clearly is ) -- then it will all collide at the SAME SINGLE NON-MOVING POINT _- which is WHAT WE SEE.   This is ONLY explainable via "scuttling dust"... NOT AT ALL via "airborne dust following the same parabola as Cernan"...   And especially not for 1/3rd of a second...

Do you picture some perfect stream of dust all aligned all traveling the same path -- but with a 1/3rd second span??

3

The Hoax Theory / Re: Hoax? - Flag moves without being Touched

« Last post by Jason Thompson on Today at 05:58:58 AM »

It's very odd that the man who went through the worst of it, has no clue what they even are.[/b]

Since it had no bearing whatsoever on his piloting the craft to the Moon, nor what the bulk of his mission actually entailed, no it's not. You don't burden people doing complex tasks with a need to remember irrelevant details, and when you're learning complex tasks you don't focus on the things you hear about that have no bearing on the task at hand. You certainly don't expect them to remember those details decades later.

This is such a boring and oft-repeated argument. You are bringing nothing new here.

4

The Hoax Theory / Re: Hoax? - Lunar Launches - Too Fast

« Last post by najak on Today at 05:53:24 AM »

You're accusing genuine American heroes, patriots, pilots and engineers of being despicable liars.  You are definitely NOT on the same side as Jay, or anyone else here who acknowledges the monumental accomplishments of NASA's Apollo program. 

You diminish those great men and women with your narcissistic claptrap.

Even if we didn't land men on the moon, they are all Patriots, carrying the burden of secrecy about a celebrated public narrative.  This was an operation run by the DoD, with the "excuse" of "fooling the Russians"... even if their excuse was disingenuous.  The Astronauts are all Patriotic military men, except one - and he's a patriot too.  If they had spilled-the-beans, it would have been Treason.   We "won a war" without firing a shot.  Kudos.

To be sure they went, I'm looking at the most compelling proofs that they didn't so that I can weigh them, see if they stand.  I won't find many good answers inside MLH forums, only here where there is extreme resistance.

If we've got to lie and hide to protect NASA's claims - this doesn't sit well with me.  So if there are MLH proofs that hold any merit, I want to present them accurately.

Personally, I'm seeing too many instances of "breaking physics" for me to just ignore them.   So I'm digging down deep, to see if any of it holds water.  This shouldn't piss you off.

5

The Hoax Theory / Re: Hoax? - Sand Falls too Fast.

« Last post by Miss Vocalcord on Today at 05:52:17 AM »

@Mag40 - your video of the Hippity -- SHOWS the dust falling FASTER than Cernan!

The fact that it doesn't fully stop it's horizontal motion, is expected.   It rises with his boot... to the boot level... then FALLS FASTER!!...  then scuttles along the ground until it hits a high spot.

No, you are simply dead wrong on this. I can see clearly what Mag40 points out.

6

The Hoax Theory / Re: Hoax? - Sand Falls too Fast.

« Last post by Mag40 on Today at 05:48:29 AM »

@Mag40 - your video of the Hippity -- SHOWS the dust falling FASTER than Cernan!

The fact that it doesn't fully stop it's horizontal motion, is expected.   It rises with his boot... to the boot level... then FALLS FASTER!!...  then scuttles along the ground until it hits a high spot.

This dust STARTED at the same level -- then FALLS TO THE GROUND _- it's right in front of your eyes.

Since it's far away... I've agreed to ignore these.    But if you insist on using them - you MUST see the dust at boot level falling faster than Cernan.  It is blatant.

This is just denial and a demonstration (not that any were needed) that nothing you can say to this guy will make any difference.

Ok fellow members, tell me I'm wrong and I'll just shut up.

This is Cernan carrying a wave of dust to the same height as his boot. Obviously lower parts of the wave fall quicker.
I can see the wave rising and falling all the way to the ground in sync with his jump:

ARE YOU SERIOUSLY CLAIMING THERE IS NO DESCENDING DUST WAVE ENDING WITH THE VISIBLE SPLASH AS HE LANDS!

7

The Hoax Theory / Re: Hoax? - Sand Falls too Fast.

« Last post by najak on Today at 05:41:53 AM »

@Mag40 - your video of the Hippity -- SHOWS the dust falling FASTER than Cernan!

The fact that it doesn't fully stop it's horizontal motion, is expected.   It rises with his boot... to the boot level... then FALLS FASTER!!...  then scuttles along the ground until it hits a high spot.

This dust STARTED at the same level -- then FALLS TO THE GROUND _- it's right in front of your eyes.

Since it's far away... I've agreed to ignore these.    But if you insist on using them - you MUST see the dust at boot level falling faster than Cernan.  It is blatant.

In this image - we can see that ALL DUST that USED TO BE LEVEL WITH THE BOOT, is not down at ground level, scuttling along.

8

The Hoax Theory / Re: Hoax? - Sand Falls too Fast.

« Last post by najak on Today at 05:36:29 AM »

Nope.

#1: Your GIF emphasizes something.  On the NASA link I do not see it.  Faint pixelation makes this hard to discern.  So for sake of argument I GRANTED you the "dust between the feet"... but there are two good explanations for it -- both given.
a. The dust rising faster than the boot from the launch... it was about 50% ahead of the boot.
b. Kicked dust "forward" was ABOVE THE BOOT (shown in the photo) - so clearly this could have been your parabola.

#3:  The entire John Young video is plagued with ambiguity -- PROVEN by the photo which clearly shows dust ABOVE the boot at apex.... therefore we are NOT dealing with "two objects both launched at the same time" or "falling from the same distance".   The ONLY dust you can meaningfully measure here is the dust BELOW the bottom of the boot that never rises above the boot.  If this dust falls faster than the astronaut, then "Houston we've got a problem."   Once there is dust ABOVE IT -- which is faint and dissipated - we have nothing to go on.

#5: In all three Cernan jumps, the dust is landing many feet in front of him -- therefore there is "flinging/kicking" action.   The chaos, and the far distance makes this ambiguous.   If you throw sand sideways along the ground, it will scuttle... it's doesn't stop instantly.   The fact that for 10 frames it all shows up in ONE NON-MOVING DOT -- indicates the "scuttle" action.   All 3 hops are similar in nature.... all potentially with the same scuttle effect... this should be expected.

===
Why do you keep avoiding the ONE EXAMPLE we have that is most clear?  the side-leap.

Check it out and comment:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JRjdohQ0cXftl_feaVeMT1rdYSlkS7mS/view?usp=drive_link

9

The Hoax Theory / Re: Hoax? - Lunar Launches - Too Fast

« Last post by beedarko on Today at 05:22:37 AM »

I'm getting pissy, because Jay is choosing to "posture/stall/hide" rather than simply be productive and make this proof that he says is doable.  I'm on his side here...

You're accusing genuine American heroes, patriots, pilots and engineers of being despicable liars.  You are definitely NOT on the same side as Jay, or anyone else here who acknowledges the monumental accomplishments of NASA's Apollo program. 

You diminish those great men and women with your narcissistic claptrap. 

10

The Hoax Theory / Re: Hoax? - Sand Falls too Fast.

« Last post by najak on Today at 05:18:41 AM »

#1: As Young jumps, the toe of his boot launches regolith upwards. Some if it is launched higher than others, because physics. Impart the same energy to objects of different mass and they respond on a way relative to that mass.
#2: Everything else is pure conjecture on your part, based on a biased interpretation of poor quality TV footage.
#3: Put the footage in its proper context: hours long EVA broadcast featuring multiple occasions where the astronauts cross paths and do other things that would make any kind of harness impossible. Lunar regolith is repeatedly shown to behave in a manner entirely consistent with an air less low gravity environment, and there's the added bonus of a completely accurate view of Earth.
#4: Oh, and astronaut movement looking funny when you speed up the footage isn't the win you think it is.

#1: Correct.  It's messy and ambiguous.  The faint dust mist that Mag40 loves, is ambiguous/unclear.
#2: I don't think the Side-Jumping Astronaut is "Conjecture"...  This is MY FOCUS, because it's the one is closest-up and doesn't have dust being flung chaotically.  Almost all dust involved here, rises beneath the foot, mostly upwards.   What do you think of this one?
#3: "Crossing paths" - perhaps you should make a thread on this, and present what you believe are the "best cases" that present something "non-feasible to fake".
#4: This isn't a "win" other than the claim that "this unnatural looking movement is non-feasible to have been done on purpose" (so that when it was slowed down, it wouldn't look too slow motion).