Request for peer review of my flat Earth disproofs

[Gazpar]

Have you ever heard of the Electromagnetic Accelerator? Its basically magic bendy light, the ultimate ad hoc ever.
Also, dont forget of Quantas Flights from Sydney to Santiago of Chile which are impossible in a flat earth. Flatties claim they are fake, lol.

[AstroBrant]

@Count Zero:
"Modern" flat-Earthers believe the sun and moon both remain on a plane roughly 3000 miles above the earth's surface. My argument states that the earth couldn't possible ever get between them. Not to mention that their model of the earth is about 260 times the diameter of the sun and moon.

@Gazpar:
I haven't run into this "shadow object" business before, but it figures that someone would come up with that, sooner or later. He decided to make it 5 to 10 miles in diameter and close to the sun, I guess so he could claim that's why we can't see it. But that doesn't work, either. At only 1/6 to 1/3 the diameter of the sun, nothing even close to a total lunar eclipse could ever occur. A penumbral eclipse is all we would see, and even that would only be a slight darkening of the moon. Let's remember that they say the moon and sun are about the same size, so this object would also only be 1/6 to 1/3 the diameter of the moon. So it could never cast an umbral shadow which covers the whole moon, no matter where you place it.

[AstroBrant]

Have you ever heard of the Electromagnetic Accelerator? Its basically magic bendy light, the ultimate ad hoc ever.
Also, dont forget of Quantas Flights from Sydney to Santiago of Chile which are impossible in a flat earth. Flatties claim they are fake, lol.

Good old "bendy light." Concave-Earthers like that one. I want to see one of them use that to try to get out of a speeding ticket.

[AstroBrant]

It just gets too far away to see, and the rising and setting is due to "the law of perspective".

Thats wrong. For the sun to appear set or rise on the horizon it must be at an infinite distance from you but its degrees above the horizon never reaches 0.
I hate when they use perspective without knowing how it works.

I've calculated that even from New Zealand, on the December solstice at midnight, (when the sun is at its greatest distance), it is still 13 degrees above the horizon in their model.

[AstroBrant]

Thank you to all of you generous, helpful people for taking the time to review my work. I wanted to get feedback since I use it so much. I'll check back in a few days to see if there are any other comments.

Clear skies,
Brant

[Gazpar]

@Gazpar:
I haven't run into this "shadow object" business before, but it figures that someone would come up with that, sooner or later. He decided to make it 5 to 10 miles in diameter and close to the sun, I guess so he could claim that's why we can't see it. But that doesn't work, either. At only 1/6 to 1/3 the diameter of the sun, nothing even close to a total lunar eclipse could ever occur. A penumbral eclipse is all we would see, and even that would only be a slight darkening of the moon. Let's remember that they say the moon and sun are about the same size, so this object would also only be 1/6 to 1/3 the diameter of the moon. So it could never cast an umbral shadow which covers the whole moon, no matter where you place it.

I have never seen an debunk for that until now, thanks.
I have another idea. There are times of the day during sunset and sunrise where the sun is below the clouds. How does that happen if its 3000 miles above the surface?

Have you ever heard of the Electromagnetic Accelerator? Its basically magic bendy light, the ultimate ad hoc ever.
Also, dont forget of Quantas Flights from Sydney to Santiago of Chile which are impossible in a flat earth. Flatties claim they are fake, lol.

Good old "bendy light." Concave-Earthers like that one. I want to see one of them use that to try to get out of a speeding ticket.

The wont buy a ticket for that because they know it would destroy the model. The would rather milk their fanbase with expensive but useless experiments like balloons and lasers.
There is some youtuber that is asking for donations so they can buy a $3000-2500 balloon and send it to space when in reality they cost much much less (gee, I wonder where all the rest of the money will go). Some guys asked if he is going to launch it at night to see if the sun is there and all they got was silence.

[Chew]

Tell them to drive one of these longest straight roads in the world, one with mostly an east-west component, and compare their odometer to the distance dictated by the flat earth model:

http://www.dangerousroads.org/rankings23/3759-the-10-longest-straight-roads-in-the-world.html

The driving distance between the icons for the I-10 in the attached Google Earth file is 78.9 statute miles; the FE distance would be 92.5 statute miles.

For the icons marking the Eyre highway in Australia, the driving distance is 154 km; the FE distance would be 386 km.

https://sites.google.com/site/chewtansy/msfn/Straight%20roads.kmz

[theteacher]

Thank you to all of you generous, helpful people for taking the time to review my work. I wanted to get feedback since I use it so much. I'll check back in a few days to see if there are any other comments.

Clear skies,
Brant

Are you aware of this?

http://www.skysailtraining.co.uk/dipping_distance.htm

[Chew]

AstroBrant, are you familiar with David Ridlen? He posted a massive FE debunk on metabunk a month ago: https://www.metabunk.org/earth-curvature-refraction-experiments-debunking-flat-concave-earth.t6042/page-3#post-162542

[Gazpar]

One last thing astrobrant...
FEs argue that GPS, weather forecasts, etc... are pure ground based. The fact that sky waves and ground waves (which take into account the curvature of the earth) exist debunk that claim.

[Chew]

Also, dont forget of Quantas Flights from Sydney to Santiago of Chile which are impossible in a flat earth. Flatties claim they are fake, lol.

And for the pilots to keep the secret the Earth is really flat they would have to fly the route as if the world were a globe. Which means flying ridiculously out of the way if the world were flat. Using data from FlightAware for Qantas 28 I tabulated the distances between round and flat earth. On a globe the distance was 6500 nautical miles; on a flat earth it was 22,100 nautical miles.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/QFA28/history/20150919/1730Z/SCEL/YSSY/tracklog

[Gazpar]

Also, dont forget of Quantas Flights from Sydney to Santiago of Chile which are impossible in a flat earth. Flatties claim they are fake, lol.

And for the pilots to keep the secret the Earth is really flat they would have to fly the route as if the world were a globe. Which means flying ridiculously out of the way if the world were flat. Using data from FlightAware for Qantas 28 I tabulated the distances between round and flat earth. On a globe the distance was 6500 nautical miles; on a flat earth it was 22,100 nautical miles.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/QFA28/history/20150919/1730Z/SCEL/YSSY/tracklog

You could take into account the flights from Perth, australia to South Africa which are impossible in a flat earth.

[Peter B]

Looks like Gazpar has been around the block with these people. To add to the list, they also deny gravity. And they say the sun doesn't rise and set. It just gets too far away to see, and the rising and setting is due to "the law of perspective" or optical illusion.

For those who aren't aware of the "modern" flat Earth model, they believe in the UN flag style map, with the North Pole at the center, and all celestial objects circle around about 3000 miles above the earth. The sun orbits around the North Pole, going from tropic to tropic for the seasons.

I take it that's their explanation for the coldest parts of the Earth being the circle at the centre and the outer perimeter, and the warmest part being the donut shape between them?

[Gazpar]

Looks like Gazpar has been around the block with these people. To add to the list, they also deny gravity. And they say the sun doesn't rise and set. It just gets too far away to see, and the rising and setting is due to "the law of perspective" or optical illusion.

For those who aren't aware of the "modern" flat Earth model, they believe in the UN flag style map, with the North Pole at the center, and all celestial objects circle around about 3000 miles above the earth. The sun orbits around the North Pole, going from tropic to tropic for the seasons.

I take it that's their explanation for the coldest parts of the Earth being the circle at the centre and the outer perimeter, and the warmest part being the donut shape between them?

Yes.

[ka9q]

Rather than look for a visible curvature of the earth from altitude, I suggest measuring the angle between the local vertical and the horizon. This decreases from 90 degrees rather rapidly with altitude as shown by the "beam tilts" built into many broadcasting antennas on tall towers.

A UHF TV broadcast antenna pattern is typically a flat horizontal disc. The frequency is high enough (and the antenna tall enough) that the disc is very thin, ie., the antenna is very directional in the vertical plane. If the disc were exactly perpendicular to the tower, much of the radiated power would miss the earth and fly uselessly into space. So these antennas are usually constructed with a downward beam tilt.

As an example, the PBS TV station where I interned in the 1970s now has a digital transmitter on RF channel 29 (virtual channel 67). The antenna is 309 meters above average nearby terrain and 464 meters above sea level. It has an electrical downtilt of 0.75 degrees. I haven't done the calculations but I'm pretty sure they're consistent with an earth radius of approximately 6378 km...