Shenzhou 7?

[Andromeda]

Some digging indicates Dr Zheng worked at CIRES, not the JPL at the time he allegedly spoke to that journalist (2008) - lousy journalism or a lie?

[Jason Thompson]

My research is more on two things:
1.) The history of manned spaceflight and the details of all of these missions.
2.) Orbital Mechanics.

And yet you're arguing physics here. Shenzhou 7's spacewalk has nothing to do with either of those two things.

For the history of manned spaceflight, I have been studying, researching and reading up on that for about one year and seven months.

I'll take my over a decade of research on that subject, and the various presentations on it I have made in that time, over your short time.

The number of years and months is no issue, however. It is the INTENSITY of the research that matters.

You know one person on this discussion has a couple of degrees in physics, right? Want to argue that her research and understanding is inadequate?

[Jason Thompson]

If Zheng confirms that he still doubts the Chinese spacewalk in his reply to my email, I can officially say I have a NAMED expert on my side. I do, however, have an UNNAMED expert on my side, and this individual told me they plan to do a lot of optical research into the video before going public with their findings. That is good, because it fits the scientific method. First conduct all other steps before reporting your results. You may choose not to believe that my unnamed expert exists, but you're only doubting reality. I will be glad to hear back from Qu Zheng.

One named and one unnamed expert, versus every other expert in the field who does not agree?

[VincentMcConnell]

Prove he is not moving at all, and has no residual momentum from when he last was.

Watch the video. He moves, kills his relative motion to the side of the orbital module, but then, without moving again, his legs just float right back up. I'd have to make a video of the spacewalk showing a static point to display relative motion, but I have many things to do before I work on that.

Cite them.

As I have said, I have one unnamed expert on my side and one named. Simply because they do not wish to go public does not make them non-existent. Even IF you choose to believe I am lying about that, Qu Zheng, engineer at JPL has expressed doubts about the Chinese spacewalk. I will cite his exact reply when I receive a message from him via email. He is real, as the jpl email I used actually was sent to [EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED].

In addition, Bruce McCandless was very controlled when doing the untethered walk with the MMU.

His center of mass is the center of rotation for his legs. If, however, you don't want to take Bruce McCandless as an example, I provided a statement that I have pictures of astronauts working on hubble with their bodies straight throughout their EVA. You simply chose to ignore that part of my comment.

[VincentMcConnell]

One named and one unnamed expert, versus every other expert in the field who does not agree?

As equal as a logical fallacy by a moon hoax believer. You say EVERY expert in the field thinks the Shenzhou spacewalk was real? PROVE IT. Cite every single qualified individual since 2008 and provide evidence to back up the claim that all of them think the spacewalk was real. You simply can't throw around a statistic with absolutely no evidence. I hypothesize that many experts don't believe it, but have chosen not to go public for any number of reasons, not limited to fear of being looked at like a moron. Now, that's only a hypothesis, so I will spend as much time as I have to try to find experts who don't believe that spacewalk was real.

Here is a relevant question for you. Zheng is an engineer at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory and has confirmed he does not believe the Shenzhou 7 mission was real. How do you feel about his qualifications? Do you think he is an idiot? Do you think he damaged his credibility by making that statement?

[Andromeda]

One named and one unnamed expert, versus every other expert in the field who does not agree?

As equal as a logical fallacy by a moon hoax believer. You say EVERY expert in the field thinks the Shenzhou spacewalk was real? PROVE IT. Cite every single qualified individual since 2008 and provide evidence to back up the claim that all of them think the spacewalk was real. You simply can't throw around a statistic with absolutely no evidence. I hypothesize that many experts don't believe it, but have chosen not to go public for any number of reasons, not limited to fear of being looked at like a moron. Now, that's only a hypothesis, so I will spend as much time as I have to try to find experts who don't believe that spacewalk was real.

Here is a relevant question for you. Zheng is an engineer at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory and has confirmed he does not believe the Shenzhou 7 mission was real. How do you feel about his qualifications? Do you think he is an idiot? Do you think he damaged his credibility by making that statement?

I've already picked plenty of holes in that line of argument.

1. He is quoted in a biased and highly unreliable source.
2. It was almost 4 years ago, and I can find no comment from him since.
3. He didn't work at JPL at the time, he worked at CIRES.

[VincentMcConnell]

Some digging indicates Dr Zheng worked at CIRES, not the JPL at the time he allegedly spoke to that journalist (2008) - lousy journalism or a lie?

http://trs-new.jpl.nasa.gov/dspace/items-by-author?author=Qu%2C+Zheng

It could not have been a lie. The article was *supposedly* written before he worked at JPL, but he did in fact/does work at the JPL, as evident by the link I posted above. If you think the article was written before he worked at JPL, yet he went on to work there, does that suggest the journalist who wrote the article can see the future??

[Jason Thompson]

Watch the video. He moves, kills his relative motion to the side of the orbital module, but then, without moving again, his legs just float right back up. I'd have to make a video of the spacewalk showing a static point to display relative motion, but I have many things to do before I work on that.

Please provide the precise time reference. Don't worry about making fancy videos, just point to a precise part of the existing one.

I provided a statement that I have pictures of astronauts working on hubble with their bodies straight throughout their EVA. You simply chose to ignore that part of my comment.

No, I addressed that. Shorter tethers, multiple attachment points and occasionally their feet are also attached. Not comparable.

[VincentMcConnell]

I've already picked plenty of holes in that line of argument.
1. He is quoted in a biased and highly unreliable source.
2. It was almost 4 years ago, and I can find no comment from him since.
3. He didn't work at JPL at the time, he worked at CIRES.

1. Does that change his verbatim quotes? The source being biased has no bearing on the fact that his quotes were word for word on that article.
2. Jarrah White emailed Qu Zheng in 2010 who confirmed he still sticks with the idea that Shenzhou 7 was faked.
3. He works for JPL now... If the article was supposedly written before he worked at JPL, yet he works there now, does that mean the writer of the article was psychic? Could they see the future? No. It seems more likely that whatever source you found to suggest he worked at CIRES at the time is simply wrong.

[Andromeda]

Some digging indicates Dr Zheng worked at CIRES, not the JPL at the time he allegedly spoke to that journalist (2008) - lousy journalism or a lie?

http://trs-new.jpl.nasa.gov/dspace/items-by-author?author=Qu%2C+Zheng

It could not have been a lie. The article was *supposedly* written before he worked at JPL, but he did in fact/does work at the JPL, as evident by the link I posted above. If you think the article was written before he worked at JPL, yet he went on to work there, does that suggest the journalist who wrote the article can see the future??

That paper was written 2 years after the date of the alleged interview.

I suggest that the journalism was bad or a lie which evolved in this way:

Zheng worked at CIRES --> CIRES collaborates with the JPL --> Zheng works at the JPL.

It's similar to how Bill was claimed to work at NASA.

[VincentMcConnell]

That paper was written 2 years after the date of the alleged interview.
I suggest that the journalism was bad or a lie which evolved in this way:
Zheng worked at CIRES --> CIRES collaborates with the JPL --> Zheng works at the JPL.
It's similar to how Bill was claimed to work at NASA.

No. Zheng DOES work at JPL. His email proves that. Say the interview was conducted at the time he worked at CIRES. OK. Now the article says he worked at JPL, yet if what you say is true, he doesn't really work for JPL. Later on, however, he goes on to work for JPL! That means that that simple lie was actually a prophecy! The odds of the lie being an accurate prediction are worse than the odds that your source saying he worked at CIRES is simply wrong.

[Jason Thompson]

If the article was supposedly written before he worked at JPL, yet he works there now, does that mean the writer of the article was psychic? Could they see the future? No. It seems more likely that whatever source you found to suggest he worked at CIRES at the time is simply wrong.

No, it's just bad journalism. Many people claim that Bill Kaysing worked for NASA. He never did. He worked for Rocketdyne, whichw as contracted by NASA to provide engiones for their rockets. Nonetheless, many people who quote him as an expert in the Apollo hoax garbage insist he worked for NASA.

[Jason Thompson]

That paper was written 2 years after the date of the alleged interview.
I suggest that the journalism was bad or a lie which evolved in this way:
Zheng worked at CIRES --> CIRES collaborates with the JPL --> Zheng works at the JPL.
It's similar to how Bill was claimed to work at NASA.

OK. Now the article says he worked at JPL, yet if what you say is true, he doesn't really work for JPL.

No, what Andromeda said is that he did not work for JPL at the time the article was written.

Later on, however, he goes on to work for JPL! That means that that simple lie was actually a prophecy! The odds of the lie being an accurate prediction are worse than the odds that your source saying he worked at CIRES is simply wrong.

Bullcrap. Why are the odds of someone who works for a company that collaborated with JPL going on to work with JPL so low? Never heard of headhunting on the corporate world?

[VincentMcConnell]

Please provide the precise time reference. Don't worry about making fancy videos, just point to a precise part of the existing one

OK, but I will have to watch the whole video, and so my response will be in ten minutes at the least.

No, I addressed that. Shorter tethers, multiple attachment points and occasionally their feet are also attached. Not comparable.

In the photos I have, they are not tethered.

[Jason Thompson]

In the photos I have, they are not tethered.

Post them.