Apollo XIII-inconsistences

[smartcooky]

The question regarding his training or experience in photographic interpretation is acute.  It is not a diversion.  Photographic analysis and interpretation is a formally defined field in which one can earn competence through training in the proven techniques and experience applying them.  Simply looking at the photograph and saying what one thinks it depicts is not photographic interpretation as is defined by its practitioners.  In short, one can certainly be incompetent at it.  And since few if any conspiracy theorists can describe any of the elements in its formal body of knowledge, it's safe to say that one should be assumed to have only layman's knowledge until they substantiate or demonstrate differently.

IIRC a certain HB by the name of Jack White declared himself an expert in photographic analysis when he testified before the US Congress with regards to the JFK assassination, that was until a lawyer (Goldman?) tore his testimony to shreds.

[smartcooky]

If it's a video camera, yes, but if it was a 16mm film camera, wouldn't the motor drive impart a twisting force on the camera, making it spin?

Ooh, that is a good point. I think that is how a reaction wheel in a satellite works. But, would such a tiny motor be sufficient to cause significant rotation of the camera

[ka9q]

IIRC a certain HB by the name of Jack White declared himself an expert in photographic analysis when he testified before the US Congress with regards to the JFK assassination, that was until a lawyer (Goldman?) tore his testimony to shreds.

Jack White was an interesting character. My only contact with him was a year or two before he died. I emailed him to politely point out some problems with his analysis of the Apollo 11 EVA picture that purportedly showed the flag reflected in the window before it had been planted.

You'd think I'd insulted his mother. How dare you email me, I'm the great Jack White, how dare you question my expertise, never talk to me again!

I think he was at least a little insecure, don't you?

When he died, the following exchange went through my head:

God: Welcome to the Pearly Gates, Jack.
Jack: Hi. Can you tell me one thing?
God: What?
Jack: Who really shot JFK?
God: Lee Harvey Oswald, all by himself.
Jack: Oh my God, "they" got to you too!?

[frenat]

I had quite a few interactions with Jack White when I used to post on the education forum.
The one I remember the most was his insistence that a still photo showing the first WTC tower collapsing (dust cloud and all) was actually depicting an explosion in building 6 and that both towers were still standing.  I searched through video archives from that day and found the footage his still came from and showed that it showed the tower collapsing.  He still didn't acknowledge it.

Most of the other interactions were about "chemtrails".  He couldn't understand how commercial airliners could fly over an airport without stopping.  He had some strange idea that the restricted airspace of an airport went up to space

EVERYTHING he had an opinion about he acted as the one and only authority on it.  If you dared question him then you were not only wrong but you must be paid to do so.  It didn't help that there were other posters on the education forum that seemed to hang on his every word and feed that belief.

[dwight]

If it's a video camera, yes, but if it was a 16mm film camera, wouldn't the motor drive impart a twisting force on the camera, making it spin?

The sequence is from the 16mm Maurer. That camera is roughly the size of a palmcorder. At no time does Haise let go of it. He is doing a selfie then turns and floats into the LM. You can see his angle and position adjustments of the camera. The shaking is minimized due to the extremely wide angle lens used (nearly fish-eyed). The distortion of the CM and LM cabins clearly shows this. I do not know what your beef is here Tarkus. You even see Haise looking at the camera to check the direction of the lens and you can see his shoulder is positioned as his arm was extended. The lord of TV and film cameras on Apollo has spoken. I now declare the counter accusations of shills and closed mindedness open.

PS. In addition to having written two books on NASA TV/Camera technology I also get paid to do image analysis and quality control and image transmission. I do know about this kind of thing and I dare say I know more about it than most given it is my profession. See above paragraph, last sentence.

[Allan F]

That wasn't tarkus asking that - but me. It was a physics question, not a hoaxer question.

[dwight]

Oops, sorry about that. I was jumping between your question and Tarkus' OP and got my responses all merged into one. And it is late. So therefore Im a boofhead. I find the original post perplexing as just because the term "selfie" is fairly recent the act of doing so has been around since cameras were invented. If the Maurer was left on its own, it would start to spin. So would the TV camera for that matter given the color wheel spinning inside it.

[ka9q]

Most of the other interactions were about "chemtrails".  He couldn't understand how commercial airliners could fly over an airport without stopping.  He had some strange idea that the restricted airspace of an airport went up to space

I got an ADS-B receiver a while ago so I've been watching (some of) the air traffic in my area. I *often* see airplanes crossing the airport, usually at right angles to the single runway and at moderate to high altitudes. I remembered being told by pilots years ago that this was common practice because it was a one of the best places to stay out of the approach and departure paths.

Now if you want to ask me about government spy planes...

EVERYTHING he had an opinion about he acted as the one and only authority on it.  If you dared question him then you were not only wrong but you must be paid to do so.  It didn't help that there were other posters on the education forum that seemed to hang on his every word and feed that belief.

Exactly my impression. Was he always like this, or did he get worse in his old age? That takedown by the House assassinations committee must have hurt.

[smartcooky]

I got an ADS-B receiver a while ago so I've been watching (some of) the air traffic in my area. I *often* see airplanes crossing the airport, usually at right angles to the single runway and at moderate to high altitudes. I remembered being told by pilots years ago that this was common practice because it was a one of the best places to stay out of the approach and departure paths.

That reminds me of a story about a student pilot on first solo approach (I make no claims about truth or accuracy, but who wants to let the truth get in the way of a great story). This reputedly happened right here at Nelson Airport some years ago.

The student in question had been briefed to make a couple of short approaches followed by touch-and-go then after the second circuit, to execute what is known as "standard overhead" join, a manoeuvre where the aircraft crosses over the aerodrome downwind at an altitude not less than 1500 feet. At this point, the pilot would call the tower and report their tail number, "standard overhead" and their altitude, so for example..... "Nelson tower, Echo Foxtrot Sierra, Standard Overhead, 1,600 feet". They would then be cleared to execute a  180° to ~ 230° tear-drop turn to landing.

The student dutifully completed his two bump and goes as instructed then set for the overhead join. As he did so, the student (nervously) called the tower "Nelson tower, this is Echo Foxtrot Sierra, Standard Overhead, 16,000 feet".... there was a long silence before a mystery voice (probably another pilot in the circuit), popped up mimicking an American southern accent....

"Welcome home Columbia!"

[tarkus]

Haise making a selfie?  cell phones did not exist in 1970

And?

... but if what you suggest is that made a selfie with a Hasselblad,

No I didn't. I appreciate English is supposedly not your first language, but I clearly mentioned the word 'video'. Hassleblads don't do video.

 with one hand and without looking at the camera because ... it's the strangest selfie I've seen in my life, Haise also must have an arm of at least 1 meter long,

Based on...?

I have an idea how long Haise's arms are, I've met him.

 if one follows the sequence is clear that the scene was filmed by a fourth man, certainly in a study.

If one follows the sequence it is clear that there is no 4th man there. Haise films it himself. He also does it in other sequences.

You are deluded and sadly lacking in any kind of background education in this subject. I'd give it up if I were you.

I never saw a selfie in which the author does not look to camera, so absurd I can only laugh although I understand that you resort to such desperate answer.

[Sus_pilot]

I generally don't take selfies, but I have a series of self portraits taken when I was in photography class in high school where it was clear I was looking over the camera's left shoulder, as it were.  Lord knows where the negatives and proof sheets are 40 years later, but I assure you it's not that uncommon.

Just because you haven't seen it, it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

[Sus_pilot]

Here's a selfie I took while I was busy doing something more important, namely driving. The phone was in my lap, and I really shouldn't have done it, but it was open road.

[beedarko]

I never saw a selfie in which the author does not look to camera

Irrelevant to the point of ludicrousness.

Can you return to the SM visibility claim?  You've been rather quiet on the subject since this excellent small scale demonstration was posted.

[Echnaton]

I never saw a selfie in which the author does not look to camera, so absurd I can only laugh although I understand that you resort to such desperate answer.

Hmmm, who is the one sounding desperate?

[dwight]

Tarkus, if you watch the whole sequence, Haise does look at the camera at one point. So am I to understand the whole of Apollo 13 was fake because Haise didn't look at the camera (even though he clearly did)?? Wow the hoax movement has really begun to scrape the bottom of the barrel.

BTW Tarkus, type in "selfie not looking at camera" into google. That might change your never having seen a selfie not looking into the camera claim.