Why I suspect Apollo was a hoax.

[Neil Baker]

You mean the attendants outside the chamber? Or those going in and out when preparing for the test, or escorting the subject out after it's completed?

No, I mean the two helmeted men wearing oxygen masks that stay in the chamber when the doors are closed and are seen removing their masks when the door is open. You can see the back of one of their helmets as the test is being conducted.

According to this chart, https://user.engineering.uiowa.edu/~cfd/pdfs/tables/7-2B.pdf, pressure at an altitude of 75,000 feet is 1.13 in.Hg.
According to this conversion chart, http://www.onlineconversion.com/pressure.htm, 1.13 in.Hg. = 28.7 torr
High vacuum is defined as that pressure between 1X10-3 Torr to 1X10-9 Torr
They weren't anywhere near high vacuum.
Better luck next time.
I seriously doubt that pressure could be maintained at high vacuum in any with a sublimator inside constantly filling the chamber with steam. It's too bad we don't have photos, video or specs in more than 50 years to help determine how they allegedly did it.

[JayUtah]

I seriously doubt...

Of course you do.  You've sidestepped every single bit of evidence that contradicts your preconceived belief.

It's too bad we don't have photos, video or specs in more than 50 years to help determine how they allegedly did it.

It's too bad you're the only "engineer" who thinks so, and that that's demonstrably due to your ineptitude.

[Neil Baker]

Returned from where? And how do you know from where they were returned?

Well flight and telemetry data indicate the vehicle travelled to the Moon and landed, three times if you read the article, took images of the surrounding area and sample the soil strength leading to manned landings on the Moon.  Then Apollo 12 followed some three years later.  http://www.lpi.usra.edu/lunar/missions/apollo/apollo_12/
As witnesses, I have no particular names but several including myself watched the Saturn V lift the craft into LEO.  The mission included a more precise landing than A11, which was accomplished near the Surveyor crater.  Images came be found at http://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/frame.html.  Pete and Alan used their sublimators on two EVA's, one to the Surveyor 3 site, at which photos were taken.  Upon lift off  Intrepid rendezvous with Yankee Clipper rock samples and Surveyor parts are transferred to the CSM.   The CSM returns to the earth where the samples end up at JSC. You may view all the flight paths of the mission, the images and the transcripts all at the linked site.

Nice presentation but possibly fake. Evidence but no proof.
How do we PROVE or DISPROVE we went to the moon?
We focus on the anomaly that can be PROVEN on Earth today.
NASA allegedly has the spacesuits, sublimators and vacuum chamber. Volunteers are plentiful. Let's pump someone down wearing a suit and sublimator and PROVE that astronauts can perform EVAs and walk on the moon.
It's simple. We can end the controversy. I honestly can't figure you folks out.

[Neil Baker]

Good question and I think the major problem we're having in this country is the inability of the majority of its Citizens to confront the possibility that the government is sensationally corrupt to the point of deceiving them about murdering 3000 Americans in their faces on 9-11 and then blaming it on 19 Arabs with boxcutters.

The 9/11 attacks have absolutely nothing to do with Apollo and are therefore off topic in this section of the forum. Any further discussion should be taken to the "Other Conspiracy Theories" section. Ignoring this request will result in you being placed under moderation, which means your posts will require my approval before appearing in the forum.

And by the way, if someone lies about one thing, it doesn't mean they have lied about everything. You don't distrust everything your parents say just because they lied about Santa Claus when you were a kid.

I disagree, the 9-11 attacks have lots to do with Apollo if both are deceptions aimed at the American People to manipulate their thoughts.  The question that I was answering regarded how revelation of an Apollo hoax could ease Americans into a greater confrontation with 9-11 lies. 

If the government lies, they're committing a crime.

[Neil Baker]

Why do you assume ISS parts were vacuum tested but not the sublimators?  Why do you accept one scenario (ISS parts) without any evidence, but are unwilling to accept the other scenario (sublimators) after much documentation detailing their testing has been presented?  Why so selective?

I don't. I believe (but don't KNOW) that ISS is an unmanned prop possibly an inflatable. If any testing was performed it was probably minimal.

Earlier you suggested that Surveyor may have been used to collect and return rock and soil samples from the moon.  Do you now reject your earlier hypothesis?

That was purely speculative mind wandering and hardly a hypothesis. I don't know anything about the rocks.

[raven]

Neil Baker, direct question, if the air evacuation systems could remove the air down to LEO test conditions from a 55ft diameter by 90 ft tall in twelve hours, a time you have not disputed, why could they not keep up with the water vapour from a couple kilograms of water over a few hours?
As for 9/11, as I, and others, have said before, we have a place for such claims. Make one there, unless you are too cowardly to put your evidence on open display in a proper forum of discussion.

[Sus_pilot]

Here's a video of a UK TV presenter/journalist going into a vacuum chamber.

That's great. I like the part with the water. What do you think to that Neil? Let's recall, one of your original claims was testing a sublimator would destroy the integrity of the vacuum, but yet we demonstrably observe in this video that the 'vacuum' was maintained despite the 'boiling' water. Such is this gish gallop, Neil has changed horses with his ideas of testing the PLSS in a vacuum.

Original horse: A sublimator test would put strain on the vacuum pumps.
New horse: The PLSS and sublimator should have been tested in a vacuum.

It's obviously not high vacuum.
Notice the attendants with eyes and skin exposed.
Better luck next time.

Im fortunate enough to know Col. Richard Graham.  He's told me about the pressure suit confidence demos, and the water really does boil at room temperature, and the room does stay at roughly 90k feet.

[Neil Baker]

Neil Baker, direct question, if the air evacuation systems could remove the air down to LEO test conditions from a 55ft diameter by 90 ft tall in twelve hours, a time you have not disputed, why could they not keep up with the water vapour from a couple kilograms of water over a few hours?

You're assuming they used that vacuum chamber. This article shows a much smaller chamber and describes pumping down the chamber with her wearing the suit but without specifying to what pressure. The boiling water trick again.
http://am.blogs.cnn.com/2010/04/02/counting-down-cady/

As for 9/11, as I, and others, have said before, we have a place for such claims. Make one there, unless you are too cowardly to put your evidence on open display in a proper forum of discussion.

I was responding to the moderator's comment about 9-11. Why don't you direct him to the proper board?

[JayUtah]

We focus on the anomaly...

There is no anomaly.

We can end the controversy.

There is no controversy.

I honestly can't figure you folks out.

You mean the rest of humanity?

You need to get it in your head that you are literally the only person who has a problem with porous plate sublimators and their test regime.  And no, it's not because everyone but you is a coward.

[JayUtah]

If the government lies, they're committing a crime.

You committed a crime.  Does that mean I'm justified in assuming you're also guilty of any other crime I might choose to pin on you, without actual proof?

[JayUtah]

That was purely speculative mind wandering and hardly a hypothesis. I don't know anything about the rocks.

You don't get to simply ignore evidence that disputes your belief.  Maybe this, and not some postulated universal fear or cowardice, is why few if any people believe as you do.

[smartcooky]

Good question and I think the major problem we're having in this country is the inability of the majority of its Citizens to confront the possibility that the government is sensationally corrupt to the point of deceiving them about murdering 3000 Americans in their faces on 9-11 and then blaming it on 19 Arabs with boxcutters.

The 9/11 attacks have absolutely nothing to do with Apollo and are therefore off topic in this section of the forum. Any further discussion should be taken to the "Other Conspiracy Theories" section. Ignoring this request will result in you being placed under moderation, which means your posts will require my approval before appearing in the forum.

And by the way, if someone lies about one thing, it doesn't mean they have lied about everything. You don't distrust everything your parents say just because they lied about Santa Claus when you were a kid.

I disagree, the 9-11 attacks have lots to do with Apollo if both are deceptions aimed at the American People to manipulate their thoughts.  The question that I was answering regarded how revelation of an Apollo hoax could ease Americans into a greater confrontation with 9-11 lies. 

Apollo really happened, just as advertised. There are mountains upon mountains of evidence that proves conclusively, not just beyond a reasonable doubt, but beyond ANY doubt whatsoever that during the period 1969 to 1972, 12 Americans walked on the Moon. Anyone who thinks otherwise has rocks in their head where their brains ought to be.

As for 9/11, it was planned by a group of Arab extremists under the auspices of Al Qaeda, and executed by 19 of them. The US Government had nothing whatsoever to do with the planning and execution of the 9/11 attacks, nor did they have anything to do with the towers coming down. The only way that the US Government were at all complicit is in acting incompetently when there were warning signs. There were Arab students who were flight training in the USA, and who had reportedly said they were not interested in landing or taking off, only in flying. This was a colossal red flag. The fact that certain members of the FBI knew this and chose to do nothing about it was unforgivable.

The only thing that Apollo and 9/11 have in common that the Hoax Believers and Twoofers both have the same kinds of rocks in their heads where their brains are supposed to be. They are two groups of people, like you, where The Stupid is very strong, and who share a similarly distorted and completely whacko worldview

[raven]

Neil Baker, direct question, if the air evacuation systems could remove the air down to LEO test conditions from a 55ft diameter by 90 ft tall in twelve hours, a time you have not disputed, why could they not keep up with the water vapour from a couple kilograms of water over a few hours?

You're assuming they used that vacuum chamber. This article shows a much smaller chamber and describes pumping down the chamber with her wearing the suit but without specifying to what pressure. The boiling water trick again.
http://am.blogs.cnn.com/2010/04/02/counting-down-cady/

And your basis they couldn't keep up in that one is . . . what, exactly? Even if, if mind, why not use the bigger one?

As for 9/11, as I, and others, have said before, we have a place for such claims. Make one there, unless you are too cowardly to put your evidence on open display in a proper forum of discussion.

I was responding to the moderator's comment about 9-11. Why don't you direct him to the proper board?

Because he was responding to your claims. You're the one who brought it up in the first place on, oh, the first post.

[Neil Baker]

Im fortunate enough to know Col. Richard Graham.  He's told me about the pressure suit confidence demos, and the water really does boil at room temperature, and the room does stay at roughly 90k feet.

But pressure at an altitude of 90,000 feet is only .569 in.Hg. that converts to 14.4 Torr, nowhere near high vacuum. Yes, water will boil at room temperature if the pressure is low enough but it's deceptive to make people think high vacuum is necessary to make that happen.

But maybe we could get Colonel Graham's input into this discussion. Does he think an astronaut would want to be pumped down to high vacuum while wearing a space suit on Earth first prior to attempting it in orbit?

[Neil Baker]

Apollo really happened, just as advertised. There are mountains upon mountains of evidence that proves conclusively, not just beyond a reasonable doubt, but beyond ANY doubt whatsoever that during the period 1969 to 1972, 12 Americans walked on the Moon. Anyone who thinks otherwise has rocks in their head where their brains ought to be.

No, evidence, even a mountain of evidence is not necessarily proof. You have no PROOF. That's why there's a controversy.
The radical thing that I present to the argument is that I've delivered the anomaly that could allow PROOF today on Earth to very conveniently happen. But only if people are willing to risk being wrong and only if NASA is accountable.

As for 9/11, it was planned by a group of Arab extremists under the auspices of Al Qaeda, and executed by 19 of them. The US Government had nothing whatsoever to do with the planning and execution of the 9/11 attacks, nor did they have anything to do with the towers coming down. The only way that the US Government were at all complicit is in acting incompetently when there were warning signs. There were Arab students who were flight training in the USA, and who had reportedly said they were not interested in landing or taking off, only in flying. This was a colossal red flag. The fact that certain members of the FBI knew this and chose to do nothing about it was unforgivable.

The only thing that Apollo and 9/11 have in common that the Hoax Believers and Twoofers both have the same kinds of rocks in their heads where their brains are supposed to be. They are two groups of people, like you, where The Stupid is very strong, and who share a similarly distorted and completely whacko worldview

What are you trying to do?